As an aside one of the best "made for TV" things in recent years has to be Channel 4's Dead Set. For a relatively cheap budget they managed to get some rather good performances from the actors and it all looked quite spiffy, but most importantly the narrative was bang on and kept the pace going throughout.

Sherlock holmes is very good, BBC have great departments and do great stuff, no doubt in that, it is all about the people upstairs, Top gear is one of the best shows around globally.

But again - Top Gear have had their budget slashed, All the kids shows over the years have had their stuff slashed and good international cartoons are all but gone off the BBC.. Just goes on.

Nige, I think while the programs you and I and others hate that are on other channels, thing with those is they make a crap load of cash. BBC not spending money to pick up high popularity shows is part of its downfall. They always seem to look to make cheaper and far less interesting versions which end up being a waste of money and crap.
They need something like "The Voice" OR XFactor to get viewers and the money even if they are crap.

BBC no adds concept I have always loved but over here in New Zealand there are indeed TO MANY advert breaks but all the channels have add's and there is no licence fee. The good shows and big shows and international shows and movies are spread across all the channels.

Free to view TV is still a shadow of what it was due to Sky of course but it is at least not the fall BBC seems to be in.

Again, BBC has amazing stuff - iplayer is out on iPad etc but again due to the big wig decisions they are not making money from it. Free to people in the UK but sell a service to people outside the country to watch the shows. British people abroad miss watching some UK shows so make money off them, they would pay!

BBC has not been run properly for years.

I get what you're saying Liam but I think you crossed over slightly from the point I was trying to make, that while I have no qualms per se with the celebrity/reality/makeover challenge type programming being available for people to rot away their evening watching, this is where the BBC can capitalise by showing or continuing to show excellent dramas, scientific/nature studies and documentaries that the other channels don't provide.

Which brings me neatly back to sports and the BBCs excellent coverage of those they do show, something they really should be looking to maintain for the reasons above. WTF else are they going to fill the Sunday afternoon slots with really, repeats or garbage I'm guessing?

Do not get me wrong, in theory that is sound. BBC win awards for their shows, as I said they do make some great stuff.
BUT you need to make money and the shows you and I are likely to hate actually bring in that money and BBC needs money.

BBC is run by a bunch of idiots basically.
Great talent in many departments but run by idiots.

Pretty much very similar with the SCI, SCYFY or what ever they want to call it channel. Great shows, they have put in for some awesome shows but if profit margins are not as good as the people upstairs like then they move shows into "Death time slots" to kill them on purpose etc.

From what I have seen the BBC Coverage has been fantastic, we do get it pretty much as is a week later here and looks great! Again the teams at work generally do a great job.
To be fair though the BBC got handed the contract on a plate, at the time Bernie and Co knew there would be a huge backlash if they just gave it Sky (Who did bid more for it when the found out ITV was giving it up) and it was a chance that the BBC could not ignore.
And as you said Deviance they have got GREAT viewing figures considering F1 was in decline in general anyway due to the sport getting boring.
But how the BBC is I do not think they could afford it even when they got it.

Take the Podcast stuff. Renaming it "Free Download" But not doing it across the board, not updating the website properly, keeping it in podcast in some places and all he other daft stuff behind that decision - Creates more confusion and is plain DUMB, yet the people up in their high chairs thought it was a good idea.

BBC needs people who are with modern times running the company and they just do not have that.

Also, WTF is with this new trend of spending the first ten minutes of programme run time as some sort of extended introduction discussing what they will cover over the remaining 50 minutes? Scrap that crap and just give us the full hour FFS!

Richard Hammond is worst for this. "We're going to show you... in a minute we'll use our gubbings to show you... we let you see...

Love the BBC though, sometimes they get things done brilliantly.

Yes he is, but you do kind of expect it from his series'. I started watching that mathermatical one about hidden numbers in nature, and it was the same deal. I think what really annoys me about it is that you can't even blame it on just one production team, because it seems to be trend in everything ranging from those over to Andrew Marr's Megacities (the worst for this repetition bollocks and the most dumbed down piece I've seen yet) and even Brian Cox's series on the universe.

I can forgive all that for what is generally high quality, watchable material across the board. BBC3 especially is a triumph in my eyes, its got hold of some fantastic comedies this past year.

The more times they reiterate a point, the shorter the program can be, the cheaper the budget imo, its all about saving money, thats my theory. This is why on ITV when you watch these Obstacle course shows they show you the same failure from 26 different viewpoints.

Let's not forget that the BBC were partly responsible for Band Of Brothers, so it's not like they make sh*te all the time. I think it's probably due to new management. They'll eventually leave or get fired and maybe we'll see some decent programs come back