Tekforums
Chat => Entertainment & Technology => Topic started by: maximusotter on March 17, 2006, 18:18:48 PM
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rant: why will these upcoming new players cost $1000 when you can get a cheap DVD player for $50? yarg. Highway robbery.
Im for HD-dvd as blu-ray sounds too Superman villianesque.
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If DVDs had not been hacked the movie studios would have been quite happy for DVDs to stay. They had to move to a new encryption system to prevent piracy hence the drive for the "next big thing".
New players may cost thousands but the price will come down eventually. The PS3 may be the first "affordable" Blueray device... And its rumoured to be $450-499...
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rant: why will these upcoming new players cost $1000 when you can get a cheap DVD player for $50? yarg. Highway robbery.
Im for HD-dvd as blu-ray sounds too Superman villianesque.
I take it these HD-DVD players will be able to play normal DVDs as I dont want to be forking out for replacements for my DVD collection if and when HD-DVD starts taking over the DVD market?
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yeah, I expect players to reach $200 by Xmas. Regular DVD looks pretty sweet on the LCD as is.
I hope one of the formats dies a nasty death. Dont really care which.
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Have a look at the launch list for Bluray and tell me which of those will benefit greatly from being shown in HDTV... None iirc.
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On the subject of secure content, one of the big companies have announced they wont be pluging the analogue hole on their Blue ray players. So youll get all the full resolution video pumped out over an unsecure channel :)
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I expect the prices to drop rapidly in order to get demand going and then theres the PS3 release which has been put back, seems they are still ironing out problems.
I still remember the Betamax vs VHS battle so I wont be an early buyer, I will wait and see which wins.
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One of the "big companies" that kirika refers to is Sony. This will initially increase penetration into the market allowing early adopters to use a Blueray player with their "old" HDTV. However, when the bit is set (which it will be) they will have to upgrade their tv...
And, no matter what Sony say regarding the PS3... it has not been delayed due to Blueray. Its been delayed because its simply not ready yet. No where near by all accounts.
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On the subject of secure content, one of the big companies have announced they wont be pluging the analogue hole on their Blue ray players. So youll get all the full resolution video pumped out over an unsecure channel :)
Is that similar to the "hack" one can do in order to record box office films on their TV?
Output it through an RF converter, sure youll lose a little quality (on a regular tv you probably wont notice) and plug it into the Aerial input.
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Basically, Bluray should only output its HD content over the digital interface, eg HDMI. There are lots of HDTVs which dont have a HDMI input but only have Component, VGA etc. If you connect up using anything but the HDMI connection you should only get SDTV resolution video and not the HDTV picture that you paid for.
What Sony have said is that initially they will not enforce that, so if you are connecting over component you will be able to get the HD content. In the future this will be enforced.
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I hope one of the formats dies a nasty death. Dont really care which.
Well this has been reffered to as the whole Betamax vs VHS war all over again. I dont see any advantage with HD-DVD discs except possibly the cost.
And as Deaths Heads has said, HD signal will not be locked out from analogue inputs. :)
http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/03/14/sony_blu_ray_analogue_image_constraint/
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The advantages lie with the manufacturers. The companies that are behind the standard which becomes prevalent stand to make a *lot* of money.
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not necessarily
betamax vs VHS was some years back things have changed now
back in the time of betamax vs VHS most peeps didnt have computers or at most had a C64 or speccy
now peeps have several computers several consoles etc...
if there are big enough manufacturers promoting both sides then we may well see movies being released in both formats anyway rather than one single format & al lot of people will probably have both types of player in one form or another
there doesnt *have* to be a single dominant standard & it will help competition and pricing if there isnt tbh...
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Itll be the new "DVD -R+R" crap.
Sooner or later a company will find a way to merge the two technologies together and make a shedload of money. Then well end up buying dual format players.
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The thing with standards is that you have to pay royalties to the people that own the intellectual property behind it. The companies behind either standard stand to make alot of money if their format becomes VHS to the others Betamax.
You say big enough manufacturers promoting both sides, you still have to buy A side. The companies promoting both dont want to get their fingers burnt by choosing the wrong side. If they did they stand to lose alot of money.
And thats what its all about. Money. Not making films better, making them look better, making them sound better. Its all about making more money.
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You say big enough manufacturers promoting both sides, you still have to buy A side. The companies promoting both dont want to get their fingers burnt by choosing the wrong side. If they did they stand to lose alot of money.
exactly - so if there are big enough manufacturers promoting both sides then they have nothing to lose by releasing films in both formats. it is all about money!
People seem obsessed with VHS vs beetamax - that was several years ago - are we likely to see just one standard for games consoles? - no that would be silly - sony & MS are big enough. There is no real reason why films cant be released in both formats just as games get released in different formats.
we arent in the 1980s anymore - familys do tend to have more than one car, one TV etc... these days - lots of people on this forum have several consoles etc..
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The most hilarious thing about the securing of the content with hdcp on blu-ray is that multiple uni students have done papers proving that the hdcp system is flawed and easily breakable\avoided.
people will avoid buying the new systems to start with... but the ps3, though late, will give blu-ray a big push into the market as people wont be buying it for that but people will use it.
Sony has my money for winning this one unless hd-dvd can offer something that blu-ray cant, once people get a ps3 in their house they wont change format unless it dies.
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people will avoid buying the new systems to start with... but the ps3, though late, will give blu-ray a big push into the market as people wont be buying it for that but people will use it.
Sony has my money for winning this one unless hd-dvd can offer something that blu-ray cant, once people get a ps3 in their house they wont change format unless it dies.
and if/when MS release external HD DVD drives
then thered be two formats people would already have in thier house & not want to change.
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add-on stuff for consoles.... people always buy them.... and they are always fairly priced.....
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add-on stuff for consoles.... people always buy them.... and they are always fairly priced.....
but people will buy them
just like people will buy PS3s
no reason therefore to not have 2 formats
did the fact that sega & nintento exist stop sony from bringing out a Play station or microsoft from bringing out an X-box - erm no!
People will still buy the things we arent in the 1980s where having more than 2 TVs or 2 Cars meant you were rich - it isnt a case of either or - plenty of people have both playstations and x-boxes & there is no real reason why movie distributors cant release films in both HD DVD and blue ray format - in fact it is far easier for them to do this than it is for a games manufacturer to release titles on both PS & Xbox
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Not many to be honest, if the quality of DVD playback on the 360 is anything to go by you will be better buying a standalone.
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add-on stuff for consoles.... people always buy them.... and they are always fairly priced.....
but people will buy them
just like people will buy PS3s
no reason therefore to not have 2 formats
did the fact that sega & nintento exist stop sony from bringing out a Play station or microsoft from bringing out an X-box - erm no!
People will still buy the things we arent in the 1980s where having more than 2 TVs or 2 Cars meant you were rich - it isnt a case of either or - plenty of people have both playstations and x-boxes & there is no real reason why movie distributors cant release films in both HD DVD and blue ray format - in fact it is far easier for them to do this than it is for a games manufacturer to release titles on both PS & Xbox
I live and breathe consoles, have done since i was little, and i know how little add-ons and such sell in comparison to overall sales of the console. I also know how much companies, especially microsoft, charge for anything added on to a console, the memory card for the xbox is a prime example.
If they release the addon it wont sell all that well, that is if you can find a place that has stock of them as with any high end add-on like mech controller from the xbox
I know it will be easy to produce for both but they wont, especially as sony has their own film company that wont be releasing on hd-dvd.
Automatically bringing the blu-ray format into the household via a non-direct player (the ps3) they are gaining a foothold in what is a very expensive situation of the new media format.
People wont have multiple players, not because they cant afford to, though i am sure there are people that cant, mostly because of the hassle, of having so many players, especially if they still have vhs or dvd/5.1 combos
Only 1 format can survive, the other may hang around in the background but only 1 can be the main format. Shops dont have the space to hold a multitude of formats and they too will also favouritise the format they want to.
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maybe we should bump this thread up in a couple of years time - Im pretty confident there will be two formats without the need for a VHS vs Beetamax.
If Xboxes and Playstations can both exist at the same time then why exactly cant two types of video player.
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the thing with games consoles is that they are two seperate entities with often differing abilities and power etc, plus they are only 2 makers of them as apposed to all the different companies making these players.
it is the nature, if one format becomes more popular with consumers then the companies making that format will make more than those who are on the other format.
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it is the nature, if one format becomes more popular with consumers then the companies making that format will make more than those who are on the other format.
So?
if xbox sells more than PS then microsoft will make more than sony
doesnt mean there cant be both
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actually no, as microsoft is reportedly making a huge loss per console, and as i keep saying it doesnt have native hd-dvd playback, and an addon wont be as nice as in-built, plus the price charge, the 360 isnt much good as a method of putting the hd-dvd into the home
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M$ has never made a profit on the sale of their consoles and even when you include the licences its been iffy at best. Many Xboxes have ended up hacked as servers and similar.
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so what - they will still make a shed load on games - are you seriously suggestion that if MS gets say 70% of the market they wont make any money?
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so what - they will still make a shed load on games - are you seriously suggestion that if MS gets say 70% of the market they wont make any money?
Will they get 70% of the market? I doubt it. The PS2 is still selling well enough for sony to avoid an early price cut.
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so what - they will still make a shed load on games - are you seriously suggestion that if MS gets say 70% of the market they wont make any money?
we arent talking about the console making money, we are talking about hd-dvd and blu-ray and the fact that for the companies making the stand-alone players are only making a profit and loss based on the sale of that player...
if a family member or friend buys a ps3, they will get blu-ray discs, a person choosing a standalone player is likely to get the same standard player as then they can borrow discs. Having a large initial base in something like this can be the breaking point. Peer pressure if you like
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Microsoft said it has benefited from the release of the much anticipated Halo 2 game on the X-box.
That helped give its home and entertainment division its first profitable quarter. Operating profit was $84m, compared with a loss of $397m in the same period a year earlier.
Chief Financial Officer John Connors said that the division would be unprofitable in the first six months of 2005, and probably will not post a steady profit until the second half of 2006.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4214273.stm
Take out profits from PC games and they arent making anything from Xbox ;)
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yes but that is completely irrelevant - if they got significantly more of the market they would make more money wont they - yes they will - simple!!!!!!
There are only really two players Sony & MS - they wont have an equal share of the market - one will be bigger than the other (personally I think the PS3 will but that is for another thread) - point is does one having a larger share mean the other cant exist - um no!
so we can establish that it doesnt matter with games consoles - given that it is even easier for a movie distributor to release a movie on two formats than it is for a games distributor (remembering that the games industry is getting to be pretty much like the movie industry) - why does there actually have to be only one format?
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There will be only films coming out for only one format, to push that format, especially in the case of sony pictures as they will only release for blu-ray as they know this is a war for people and if people will buy their format because they want a film that is only on that format.
and again, this has nothing to do with xbox360 sales and playstation sales, as x360 doenst have native hd-dvd playback. this is to do with having the ability as standard playable in more homes, which will happen with the ps3 having native support
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The point Im making with the PS XBOX comparison two formats can both exist in the same market.
i.e. some films will only come out on blue ray? - some games only come out on PS or Xbox - doesnt mean they cant both exist
Also unlike the 1980s there is no reason why lots of people cant afford to have say a PS3 & a HD DVD player - there is also the chance that a manufacturer might release a player than can play both blue ray and HD DVD.
Sony pictures may only release films in the blue ray format - some other distributor might release films in only HD - DVD format - others may just release in both formats (it is a lot easier to release a film in two formats than a game & games manufacturers dont have a problem releasing titles for both PS3 & Xbox).
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It isnt financially viable for two formats for the makers of the players with consoles they use the higher price of games to keep profits higher, hardware players cant and people will go with 1 over the other, it is the nature of people
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It isnt financially viable for two formats for the makers of the players with consoles they use the higher price of games to keep profits higher, hardware players cant and people will go with 1 over the other, it is the nature of people
sorry but that is complete rubbish
there are tonnes of DVD player manufacturers & they dont make money from the titles released so there is no reason for it to not be financially viable
as for the nature of people - petrol cars/diesel cars? Play station/Xbox MP3 player/ Minidisk player
no real reason why people will all want the one particular format over the other
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yes, DVD, one format, and dvd components are cheap as anything, same with the licenses to make dvd equipment, ie the specs
unlike these new formats, which require new non-standard equipment, expensive rights, and new plants to be built
hence the price at the start
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same with DVD at the start - expensive equipment etc...
doesnt meant it isnt financially viable to have 2 types of player
Paramount have said they will release on both formats - others will probably follow suit
both sides have big backers & both will be sold in large numbers eventually - hopefully the compatition will also drive down prices
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The just need to hurry up and release a HD-DVD and Blu-Ray player, like the DVD+/-RW drive... if possible.
I sick of Hollywood and music business trying to limit how i watch or listen to stuff i bought.. maybe if they brought the prices down people would buy them rather than buy a pirated copy!
Anyhow back the the rant! CHOOSE A STANDARD PEOPLE!!! A GIVE IT TO US! AND STICK TO IT FOR A WHILE SO WE DONT END UP PAYING A FORTUNE FOR SOMETHING FOR IT TO BE OUTDATED IN 6 MONTH!
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PC drives will be more likely to come out first before the actual players afaik.