Tekforums
Chat => Photography => Topic started by: zpyder on August 14, 2010, 16:54:49 PM
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I have a 400D at the moment. Its a great camera, my first SLR. However I rarely use it as generally its more practical to be taking a tough compact with me when Im out. The most use it gets is for photomicroscopy. The big downer on this front is having to use the viewfinder to check the camera focus etc. Liveview would be a godsend in this regard, and Id get a lot more use out of an slr with live view on the grounds of my weird eye focus issues too!
Problem is the age of the camera, popped into a shop earlier to just get an idea of trade in prices and things, Id only get £100 for the body, £30 for the kit lens. Given that the 500D is £500+ it seems, Im going to have to wait a little while.
Which brings me to the question of where the best/cheapest/reliable places are for cameras at the mo. I got the 400D from Jessops some years ago as it was actually one of the cheapest places I could find.
And I guess Ill be best off selling the 400D to cover some of the cost of the upgrade, I think Ive had enough of ebays stupid fees, and not used Gumtree before. How safe is it, are there many time wasters etc? The cameras in good condition except for a few specs on the mirror, doesnt effect picture quality but is visible in the viewfinder, and the kit lens has a few minor scratches on it from being on the microscope, but again not visible in pictures. Otherwise excellent. Would £250 be reasonable?
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you could sell your 400d & get a 450d for about £100 diff on ebay.
ive considered doing the same as I also want liveview & the 450d has liveview
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Personally Id look to getting more glass but if I was really wanting to upgrade a 400D I wouldnt look to upgrade to what is basically a more up to date version in the range but perhaps look to try the next range up.
Take a look at say a 40D on e-bay - if you sell your 400D then it shouldnt cost too much to upgrade - or perhaps even the 50D since the 60D should be out soon then maybe prices of second hand/refurbished 50Ds will drop.
Personally Im still happy with my 400D - there are some instances where Id have liked spot metering and others where Id have liked more frames per second - Im not that fussed about live view though. Also better low light performance would be nice though I shoot in raw and use lightroom so its been OK so far. Overall Im glad Ive resisted the temptation to upgrade and have invested in more lenses instead. Ill probably look to upgrade in the next 6 months or so but then will likely be looking at a 7D or 60D.
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as already said the 450D has live view
Id give it a proper clean before selling to make sure you dont get moaned at, i sold a 350D with kit lens on ebay after i got my 450D and got what i wanted for it, cant remember the price but it sold quickly and trouble free.
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Yeah and I guess if the 450D is already discontinued Im guessing price will drop 2nd hand quite quickly as people replace up.
How do you go about cleaning the mirror properly? I remember at the time I tried, improved the situation a little, but dont want to make things worse. Id rather just state that it is there and let it be a case of buyer beware.
Is it better to sell on ebay than gumtree, given the stupid listing fees now? I dont need a quick sale, sometime in the next month or so would be nice though. Money wise Id rather sell the 400D before buying the replacement.
The 40/50Ds dont have live view do they? May be a silly question but just what do they offer over the consumer level stuff, just better quality?
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The 40/50Ds dont have live view do they? May be a silly question but just what do they offer over the consumer level stuff, just better quality?
They do have live view as far as Im aware. Theyre also a bit more robust/better build quality, better autofocus, faster frame rate... theyre just a step up from the rebels/XXXD series - they still have the 1.6 crop sensor but with a more robust body and more pro features...
The 40D essentially has the same sensor as the 400D (it is supposedly different with better low light performance- but essentially the same) - so if you were to take a picture of a fairly static subject on a bright sunny day using the same lens youd likely get the same image from either camera. The differences come where you want to say shoot sports or wildlife or perhaps want to shoot in low light better autofocus, faster frames per second etc.. will help.
This thread has got me weighing up the idea of purchasing a 50d, 7d or 60d(to be released soon) in a few months.
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Cheers dave.
These names are getting confusing. I wish theyd just re-do them all and list them from 1D - 10D, ranging from 1D being the top end and 10D being the entry level. Then they can just call them say 3D mkii if they update them. That way at least youd know whether going from a 7D to a 5D mkii was an upgrade or not ><
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id love a 5d mkii myself, bit pricey though
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For the idiots amongst us (me), can someone tell me what a 400d and a 500d roughly equate to in the Nikon lines ?
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400D was the canon rival to the nikon D40 and probably prompted nikon to release the D40x increasing the resolution from 6mp to 10mp
canon 500D is basically the equivalent to the nikon D5000 I think
edit:
basically from mid 2006 it seems nikon has gone from D40 -> D40x -> D60 -> D5000
in the same timeframe canon has gone from 400D -> 450D -> 500D -> 550D
Theyve both now got more basic entry level models - nikon D3000 vs Canon 1000D which dont seem to be too dis-similar to the 400D and D40 released back in 2007
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Classic, listed it on gumtree last night and its been deleted already ><
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So I have the D5000 and cant get shots as good as you guys with lesser cameras.
Proof if you ever needed it that Im useless and its all in the photographer.
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not necessarily - tis the lenses too
Best thing I did was get a prime lens (nifty fifty) and start playing with it - improved things a lot - I was pretty much forced to do so as the kit lens you get with a canon is pretty ropey.
Get this lens and keep it on your camera for a while:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nikon-50mm-F1-8D-Nikkor-Lens/dp/B00005LEN4/ref=sr_1_1/279-8106084-8849737?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1281882051&sr=1-1
It forces you to think about composition, youll get very sharp images from it as all manufacturers have been making 50mm lenses for decades and they can make the very well without the compromises needed to make a zoom. Youll have access to a much wider aperture and so can take pics in low light without flash, take pics with very shallow depth of field... tis good for portraits as you can throw everything behind the subject out of focus and its a good focal length for the face etc.. to not be distorted (50mm on your crop sensor camera is equivalent to 80mm on one of the more expensive full frame cameras).
Ive since invested in an 85mm f1.8 prime lens and a decent replacement for the kit lens that came with the camera - tamron 17-50 f2.8 is a fantastic lens - Im not sure what your standard zoom lens is like - nikon tend to put more expensive zooms with their entry level DSLRs so you might not need to replace it but Ive found that having f2.8 across all focal lengths has been great - the tamron lens was less than <£300 and tbh.. to get any better than that lens Id have to fork out for the very expensive canon equivalent costing more like £700 or get myself a 5D + the 24-70 which would cost £2.5k
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i dont agree with any of the kit lens is a bit ropey stuff, iv got some great shots with it, its still an 18-55 EF-S IS lens after all, decent range and the IS is always handy.
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i dont agree with any of the kit lens is a bit ropey stuff, iv got some great shots with it, its still an 18-55 EF-S IS lens after all, decent range and the IS is always handy.
I cant see the need for IS in that range tbh... and if you want to shoot in low light then lower f number > IS any day...
Im not saying you cant get good pictures with it but youre limited by it a lot - it is soft wide open so you have to stop it down but your aperture is already not very wide to start with so you then need to crank up the ISO in a lot of situations. On a bright sunny day at f8 youll get acceptable images - it does suffer from CA a bit but you can play around a bit in post with that.
Im just not that fussed by it - if I were worried about breaking stuff while traveling Id perhaps take it and the nifty as both are cheap to replace (or rather Ive got a replacement for the kit lens anyway) - I just preferred to have something a bit more versatile so the tamron was a very good purchase for me - especially as the equivalent 17-55 offering from canon is more than double the price with only marginal improvements on the tamron or indeed the equivalent lens from sigma.
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I have a 40D body for sale if youre interested -)
Ive had the 7D for a couple of months now and really cant fault it, amazing piece of kit.
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The 40/50Ds dont have live view do they? May be a silly question but just what do they offer over the consumer level stuff, just better quality?
They do have live view as far as Im aware. Theyre also a bit more robust/better build quality, better autofocus, faster frame rate... theyre just a step up from the rebels/XXXD series - they still have the 1.6 crop sensor but with a more robust body and more pro features...
The 40D essentially has the same sensor as the 400D (it is supposedly different with better low light performance- but essentially the same) - so if you were to take a picture of a fairly static subject on a bright sunny day using the same lens youd likely get the same image from either camera. The differences come where you want to say shoot sports or wildlife or perhaps want to shoot in low light better autofocus, faster frames per second etc.. will help.
This thread has got me weighing up the idea of purchasing a 50d, 7d or 60d(to be released soon) in a few months.
Dave Id avoid the 50D if I were you, it wasnt much of an upgrade over the 40D. The megapixel bump just resulted in a shed load of noise.
60D will be interesting, although for the intro price when it launches youll be better paying a bit more and getting the 7!
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I have a 40D body for sale if youre interested -)
But at what price? and is it the current version with live-view?
I still cant justify silly money unfortunately.
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I have a 40D body for sale if youre interested -)
But at what price? and is it the current version with live-view?
I still cant justify silly money unfortunately.
40d has live view & there isnt much price difference between used 40ds & 450ds
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Have they always had live view? For some reason I thought live view was a recent(ish) thing and 40Ds were around before it came out.
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Have they always had live view? For some reason I thought live view was a recent(ish) thing and 40Ds were around before it came out.
i believe so....
heres another reason to have live view
http://www.stopmotionpro.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=126&Itemid=80
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Yeah, pretty sold on making the jump from a xxxD to a XXD now ;)
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Yeah, pretty sold on making the jump from a xxxD to a XXD now ;)
you can shoot them on a greenscreen & make your own godzilla shows :w00t:
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not necessarily - tis the lenses too
Best thing I did was get a prime lens (nifty fifty) and start playing with it - improved things a lot - I was pretty much forced to do so as the kit lens you get with a canon is pretty ropey.
Get this lens and keep it on your camera for a while:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nikon-50mm-F1-8D-Nikkor-Lens/dp/B00005LEN4/ref=sr_1_1/279-8106084-8849737?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1281882051&sr=1-1
It forces you to think about composition, youll get very sharp images from it as all manufacturers have been making 50mm lenses for decades and they can make the very well without the compromises needed to make a zoom. Youll have access to a much wider aperture and so can take pics in low light without flash, take pics with very shallow depth of field... tis good for portraits as you can throw everything behind the subject out of focus and its a good focal length for the face etc.. to not be distorted (50mm on your crop sensor camera is equivalent to 80mm on one of the more expensive full frame cameras).
Ive since invested in an 85mm f1.8 prime lens and a decent replacement for the kit lens that came with the camera - tamron 17-50 f2.8 is a fantastic lens - Im not sure what your standard zoom lens is like - nikon tend to put more expensive zooms with their entry level DSLRs so you might not need to replace it but Ive found that having f2.8 across all focal lengths has been great - the tamron lens was less than <£300 and tbh.. to get any better than that lens Id have to fork out for the very expensive canon equivalent costing more like £700 or get myself a 5D + the 24-70 which would cost £2.5k
Good advice Dave thanks.
I have the stock Nikon 18-55 that comes with the D5000. I think Ill try one of these prime lens which I get my first pay check.
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check.
i bet you got an accent & wear a 10 gallon hat
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I have a 40D body for sale if youre interested -)
But at what price? and is it the current version with live-view?
I still cant justify silly money unfortunately.
As others have mentioned the 40D has live view.
Im looking for 400 pounds delivered (RMSD insured). Includes a spare battery as well and comes in the original box. Its been well looked after and only had 8000 actuations, so I think this is a fair price.
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Dave Id avoid the 50D if I were you, it wasnt much of an upgrade over the 40D. The megapixel bump just resulted in a shed load of noise.
60D will be interesting, although for the intro price when it launches youll be better paying a bit more and getting the 7!
Yeah Im going to wait until the 60D comes out before I make a decision - I might well end up going for the 7D - simplyelectronics are doing them for £1019 at the moment - Ill have to see what price they set the 60D and what theyve omitted compared to the 7D.
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http://www.canonrumors.com/2010/08/canon-eos-60d-picture/
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If I could afford it, would a 550D be a better buy than a 40D? I get the impression that aside from a slight drop in image quality, the 550D may be better in terms of weight and options? in 2-3 years would they both be worth about the same for when I wanted to sell on? I know the 550D is newer, but I get the impression the consumer level cameras drop in price quicker than the "prosumer" and professional ones?
EDIT:
I guess the £150 Id be saving with the 40D could be used to get a decent (ish) lens, given that I am still using the 18-55mm kit lens and a 70-300mm Sigma telephoto lens. Both of which I know are pretty much at the bottom end of the scale in terms of quality. For ~£150 what lens would be a good general performer? Im guessing a 50mm?
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The main benefit of the 550D will be HD video.
It also depends what youd like in terms of in hand size. the xxxD range is small to hold, whilst the xxD and above all tend to be larger (well normal size).
A Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II will be 75 quid. Best bang for buck lens out there.
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Im guessing itd be better to get that + some extension tubes and the likes for macro work, than forking out more for something a bit more versatile but possibly less quality?
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I wouldnt say less quality, the 550D is a great piece of kit for sure.
I just think glass is more important than the body.
The difference in IQ/creative control going from a 18-55mm to a 50mm f/1.8 is astounding.
You can also reverse a 50mm (using an adapter) to get some crazy macro performance !
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Here are some shots taken with a reversed 50mm.
http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=reverse+50mm&s=int
You should be able to attach it to the front of your 18-55 and do the same.
edit/
Further reading:
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=738167&highlight=reverse+50mm+18-55mm
HEALTH WARNING: Macro photography is very addictive! heh
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Hmm. Im still undecided (sorry!)...what will get more use 40d/550d, considering Im pretty much a nature photographer...sure more fps is great n all, but I never really had much issue with the 3.x of the 400d. 40D is bigger and heavier, not so good for carrying up a hill/mountain (but still doable).
I have small hands so the size of the body isnt much of a biggy. Im swayed by the HD video, but ultimately I dont see myself taking videos anyway so I dont get why Im that bothered by it! Biggest thing is the MP I think. 400D-40D is just a bit of an upgrade in terms of quality and functions it seems as otherwise it matches the 400D (sort of). Im guessing the 550D will be a bit noisier...but surely as its higher res if the image is resized down it wont be as noticeable? Such a dilemma! I guess if I got a 40D or similar and a 50mm lens, hopefully shutterstock and the likes will give it a rest on the noise front, and from the riches I make from the stock (HAH!) I can eventually upgrade to a 7D when Im 70.
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HEALTH WARNING: Macro photography is very addictive! heh
Tell me about it, I bloomin use a microscope for macro shots!
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Hmm. Im still undecided (sorry!)...what will get more use 40d/550d, considering Im pretty much a nature photographer...sure more fps is great n all, but I never really had much issue with the 3.x of the 400d. 40D is bigger and heavier, not so good for carrying up a hill/mountain (but still doable).
Cameras dont weigh much at all though so I wouldnt worry about carrying one up a hill even with a few big lenses etc...
the fps is perhaps useful if you want to capture birds in flight etc... or indeed anything that will move fast/suddenly - I guess it depends what sort of nature photography youre going to be into - I guess if you just want to do macro pics etc.. then perhaps a 550d will be better.
then again, given the price the 550d is currently at perhaps the 60D (when it comes out in a couple of months) could be a viable option.
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I ended up taking a bite of reality and realising that I had a budget and I couldnt just buy any camera I wanted to. Why stop at the £150 extra for a 550D, why not just get a 7D ><
Ultimately Im quite a novice when it comes to photography, and I think the 40D is "more" of a camera. Itll give me room to grow I think, and Id hope that in a couple of years time Id still be able to sell it on for £200+ (if I look after it). Itd be good to focus more on quality rather than quantity, which I think I was doing in the past, so the money saved has already meant I can afford the 50mm mkii, and a reversing ring. Is it me or have lens prices suddenly gotten a lot cheaper? I remember when I got my 400D the sigma 70-300 was quite expensive along with everything else, now theres a canon version thats Only £120 ish?
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The 40D is very well built but it has one little problem. The Card slot pins are vulnerable to damage when inserting a card. Check the card slot, especially the pins. Shine a torch in and make sure they are all undamaged.
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I think he is buying kunals rather than a random one though so its unlikely to be dodgy - if youve got a 4GB card in there then I doubt youll need to take it out unless youre off on a trip/expedition somewhere.
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Will hopefully have a 16gb card in there providing the write times arent *too* slow. When I bring a tray of insects back to photograph each insect might need 20 photos taking for a stack and each tray might have a few dozen specimens, would be handy not having to transfer photos etc. I read that a 4gb card for raw images would take about 250 photos.
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ah I guess if youve got a specific purpose like that then it changes things a bit...
for general photography stuff Ive found the only reason Id swap over the 4GB cards is if I hadnt transferred photos from one yet - in general I dont seem myself filling one up from a single days use though I guess also few people who take a more click and hope approach perhaps do.
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Id agree with you tbh, Ive only ever "run out of film" a few times. Its sounds obvious, but the only times you tend to run out of memory are the times you dont want to run out of memory...I mean its not very often youre messing about at home or something and taking a few hundred shots and then cant instantly upload...its another matter though when youre out and about doing wildlife or something...even then 9/10 you dont see much, but the other 1/10 times the only thing that makes you stop shooting is the last picture on the last memory card. When I went out dragonfly shooting last year this happened. This year with Binary I was a bit more reserved :D
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Will hopefully have a 16gb card in there providing the write times arent *too* slow. When I bring a tray of insects back to photograph each insect might need 20 photos taking for a stack and each tray might have a few dozen specimens, would be handy not having to transfer photos etc. I read that a 4gb card for raw images would take about 250 photos.
I thought liveview writes directly to you PC?
I know ive posted it before, but http://www.breezesys.com/DSLRRemotePro/ that software could be useful for you.
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Yeah, the problem is being tethered via usb cable. At home my desk is too small & cluttered to have samples, microscope and a laptop next to it. Uni itd be doable but Id be doing it on a netbook and would still end up needing to transfer from that to a PC for proper editing :D
The workflow for a camera and a remote is also much easier. 1 hand on fine focus and the other on the remote, twiddle the focus by a mm or 2 and press shutter button and repeat, rather than having to use a mouse or press a key on a keyboard.
It could be useful for stopmotion though :D
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Difference between a 4gb Sandisk Extreme IV and this Transcend 16gb 133x speed disc when taking a full burst...the 4gb took 19s to clear the buffer and the 16gb 28s to clear the buffer.
From memory I think the 400D wouldnt let you take any more photos until the buffer was cleared, but the 40D does, which is cool.
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450D does take photos when the buffer is full but very slowly as it obviously needs to clear space for the next one, very frustrating when you just want a few more shots.. arghhh
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With the 500D on JPG only mode with a class 8 card, I can keep the shots firing and not hit the buffer... if you want to get a lot of shots out then make sure you get a good card!
And if lots of shots are important, go to JPG, you only lose a bit of flexibility and can rattle out a lot more shots..
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yeah im only running a class 6 card so doesnt last that long before hitting the wall
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Aye, though I have to admit I never needed to use up a full buffer on the 400D, which was much slower and took less images before it was full, so dont see it as a problem. I tend to like to experiment with shots, and as I dont do sports, the only "fast" things I want to take lots of shots of are insects in flight (IE, Dragonflies). As a result Ill keep my finger on the shutter for a couple of seconds on the 400D, or now probably just one or two seconds, before adjusting settings and trying again, just in case I get home and discover that actually, that aperture was much better than this one etc.
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Yeah i need to think:
Short bursts, conserve your ammo...
when im out with mine or i do run it out.
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I dont know whether Ill run out with 16gb. Today this evening in 40 mins of microscopy I got through 500 shots on one beetle tray. It wasnt until shot 400 or so that the counter started to tick down from 999 :D.
I think out and about Ive more chance of the 2 batteries dying!
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RAW or JPG?
I ran out at an airshow 4gb taking jpg, 3300+ photos on there!
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Raw, since getting the 400D Ive never shot jpg. Think the 16gb takes 1500 raw files or there abouts.
Heres the first of my proper 40D microscope shots, done properly with a specialist program and around 60 photos :D
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4078/4932698079_e9ef122aea.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/zpyder/4932698079/)
Chlaenius nigricornis (http://www.flickr.com/photos/zpyder/4932698079/) by Chris_Moody (http://www.flickr.com/people/zpyder/), on Flickr
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In case anyone is interested ....
Samsung 16GB SDHC Plus Memory Card Class 6 £17.99@play
http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/samsung-16gb-sdhc-plus-memory-card-/746295
Not class 8, but a mega bargain..
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Bah humbug to the 40D still taking CF cards!
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seems all the pro canons are still on CF