Tekforums
Chat => Entertainment & Technology => Topic started by: Eagle on April 14, 2006, 23:28:52 PM
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For a while now when running games my system has been having CTDs or, more frequently, bluescreening (blank with a rapid soundloop).
Ive gone from (1Gb RAM and a ATI Radeon 9800 Pro) to (2Gb RAM and a NVIDIA 512Mb G6800 GS). The same problems occur with BOTH sets of hardware so I think we can discount the cards/memory.
I can now (finally) play games at 1280x960 with FSAA on without any stutter - but how do I begin to troubleshoot the crashing/freezing problems? Can anyone help? :)
Spec:
Abit NF7-S v2.0 mobo
Athlon XP3000+
NVIDIA 512Mb G6800 GS
2Gb Corsair 2GB DDR XMS3200C2PT RAM
Enermax 550W PSU
Soundblaster Live 5.1
Maxtor 40Gb HDD (OS/Program files)
Maxtor 160 Gb HDD (Data)
Win XP installation is about 16 months old.
nForce_5.10 drivers
Can post DXDiag if needed.
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Ive used two different sets of RAM so it cant be faulty memory. Neither is it bad GPUs.
The bluescreens are often blank - with a soundloop. :(
? Games this is happening on? - X³ Reunion, Tomb Raider: Legend, Star Wars Battlefront II.
? Crashes are happening between 2 mins and 2 hours - most within 5 mins.
? No artifacts on screen, in fact the picture is all fine and dandy. Fast frame rates too.
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Tried a few thngs today:
Installed latest nForce Drivers - CTD
Disabled Sound (in-game) - CTD
Physically removed soundcard - CTD
Replaced Soundcard - CTD
Installed Omega Drivers (Nvidia Omega Drivers 1.6693 (Forceware 66.93)) - nearly hosing my system in the process. :evil: - CTD
Installed default nVidia Drivers (on the CD) - BSOD - STOP number as follows:
0x0000008E 0xC0000005, 0xE1F98787, 0xBABBEB58, 0x00000000
Ive recently also been getting the occasional BSOD when installing software (and occasionally just after boot-up). Latest STOP number:
0x0000008E 0xC0000005, 0x8054A95B, 0xF7465B4C, 0x00000000
Help! :(
What can be causing this? Its damn frustrating and I cant lock it down. :( :cry: :(
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i would suggest a ram problem. Try getting the same results with just one stick of your new ram in
EDIT: are you overclocking anything??
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or ram settings if its with both sets of hardware in, new ram cant keep up with old settings / the settings are set to the new ram / the settings are borked ?
did it happen before the upgrade at all ?
and it it start right after the upgrade ?
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Exact same situation before and after upgrade. :(
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i would suggest a ram problem.
Its brand new and I had the same problem before the upgrade. :(
EDIT: are you overclocking anything??
Not that I know of - Im just using the same BIOS settings with my last setup, albeit with the RAM timings changed to the recommended specs of the RAM.
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take one out and test. Then swap that one into different slots.
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take one out and test. Then swap that one into different slots.
AFAIK, I can only get Dual Channel with the two slots theyre already in - is that right?
:cry:
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just try one stick in, to see if youve got a bad stick / bad slot somewhere ;)
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Check it with the game or just in Windows? :) And will I need to adjust BIOS settings? On boot, Windows reports all OK...
:)
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just do a bit of everything, if theyres something that makes it crash normally then do that
the bios settings should be ok, you could always set them all to auto :)
what normally makes it crash ?
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Its a well know Creative driver issue with there older cards.
Try moving the cards PCI slot (2nd from bottom rings a bell, but its a long time since I used that board) and disabling all devices you dont use in BIOS.
If that doesnt work the only cure is to either get a newer card or switch to the onboard, which is better than the Soundblaster anyway.
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Its a well know Creative driver issue with there older cards.
Id like to think this was the cause but I even tried running the game with the card removed from the slot... :( :? (or will it still try to use/access drivers?...)
If that doesnt work the only cure is to either get a newer card or switch to the onboard, which is better than the Soundblaster anyway.
Wont that cause problems itself? And how would I connect my speakers?
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I missed on your first post they you had tired removing the card with the same result, I had no end of problems with my NF7-S with a Soundblaster card with crashing and sound looping.
There is also a issue with later NF7-S with the Memory controller, as suggested try 1 stick of Ram, if that solves it then it is most likely a Mobo issue, seeing you have new Ram.
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Try moving the cards PCI slot (2nd from bottom
Tried that tonight. Crashes much less frequently but still crashes. :(
all devices you dont use in BIOS
Done. Still no joy.
I refuse to believe its a RAM issue but Ill try swapping the sticks around. Ive found that in order to have dual channel, one of the sticks must be in slot 3.
Lets hope thats not the one thats fecked. :roll:
If it is, what BIOS settings do I use to run non-dual?... will it make much difference to system performance?
Cheers so far. :)
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Well, Ive tried moving a stick from slot 2 to slot 1 - still CTDs. :cry: Im 99% certain its not memory related.
I want to leave moving the stick in slot 3 into slot 2 for now because I dont want to lose Dual Channel. Maybe as a last resort.
Ill bet this is something simple... isnt it always?
Would a format/reinstall help?
New soundcard?
Reset BIOS to default?
Heres my current settings (which worked (once) with my old RAM):
FSB 200MHz
AGP to 66MHz
CPU Multiplier to 11
FSB/RAM ratio to 3/3
CPU Interface Enabled
Set CPU Voltage at 1.65v
RAM voltage at 2.6v
VDD/Chipset voltage at 1.6v
AGP Voltage at 1.5v
Timings 2-3-3-6.
System and Video BIOS caching OFF
Disabled Spread Spectrum for AGP and FSB
Disabled Thermal Throttling
Aperture size at 256mb
PCI Enhance Performance on
CPU Disconnect Halt off.
AGP 8x
Fast Writes on.
Wheres the banghead smiley?... :/
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Turn off PCI Performance.
Its just Busmastering only hiding in a guise.
If you have more than one card that is trying to go "im the bus master!" then things are gonna get *ucky.
That 8E error however makes me think of my issues when I had a rubbish powersupply.
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You could test your RAM for sure with Memtest (its a DOS utility, google will find) - this has found faulty sectors on sticks Ive had in the past, usually performance ram like OCZ.
A quick check on your OS would be to shove another HDD in there and just install a clean windows and your game, if thats OK you know its not the hardware.
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Sorry m8, you PMed me for help but Im so out of touch what with not having a PC for the last 9 months that Im no good anymore. Im only using a m8s PC to type this now.
Sorry if someone else has mentioned it or if you have already tried, but you could try a fresh Windows install.
:(
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Cheers! No worries - good to see you back anyway. :)
Im trying memtest as I write (is this it this: http://hcidesign.com/memtest/ )?
That being all ok, Im going to format/reinstall Windows.
Looking at defrag, my C:\ drive is:
9% Total Fragmentation
19% File fragmentation
And thats after a defrag!!! :shock:
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I refuse to believe its a RAM issue but Ill try swapping the sticks around. Ive found that in order to have dual channel, one of the sticks must be in slot 3.
Lets hope thats not the one thats fecked. :roll:
If it is, what BIOS settings do I use to run non-dual?... will it make much difference to system performance?
Forget dual channel, its not that important. Way less so than a stable machine.
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best to do a defrag in safe mode, windows is using less files so theres more of them avalible to be defraged.... plus turn off disk caching while you do it :) (right click my computer/properties/advanced/preformance/advanced)
not that that will help you much at the mo...
Id still swap around the memory first just to double chck its not that, just try with one stick... ok your computer will be a bit slower for 5 min, but its just while you test it ;)
tho as youve tried the old stuff back in anyway, Id say go for a format :)
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Cheers fellas. :)
Im going to do a memtest first (Memtest86) How do I create a bootable CD? The websites a bit poo, tbh...
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Its easier off a floppy iirc. When youve made the Memtest floppy it cant be read by windows, thats one way of telling if its that program. You might have to buy a FDD if you havent got one!
Though - I think you just use Nero to create the CD from the ISO they have on the site.
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Well, heres the test result and Im relieved (but not surprised) to see it passed... :D
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y102/pbr/pa55.jpg)
As Ive tried running the game (Star Wars Battlefront II) without a soundcard attached - but could it still be the soundcard/drivers etc causing the problem?
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Turn off PCI Performance.
You sure?!
That 8E error however makes me think of my issues when I had a rubbish powersupply.
Everything seems fine on that side. A quick check in BIOS reveals everythings stable (no wild fluctuations). :)
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PCI performance is bus mastering. Adds nowt. Mines off, and if you have PCI performance on it means that if 2 cards are fighting for bus master then random sh*t will occur.
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if its ok without the sound card Id say the sound card is fine.
you swaped back to the old ram and gfx right ? so its nor a mem or gfx problem.
if its not the sound card, gfx card or ram then that only really leaves a M/B problem (cpu problems are pretty dame rare)...
but tbh I doubt its a m/b problem, 99 times out of a hundred id your m/b goes tits up they your pretty unlikely to get into windows at all.
format and re-install is the only real option now tbh.
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PCI performance is bus mastering. Adds nowt. Mines off, and if you have PCI performance on it means that if 2 cards are fighting for bus master then random sh*t will occur.
eh?? bus mastering is where devices are allowed to comunicate with each other and not use the CPU
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if its ok without the sound card Id say the sound card is fine.
It even crashed with the soundcard removed. :(
you swaped back to the old ram and gfx right ? so its nor a mem or gfx problem.
The crashing occured with my old hardware and new hardware.
format and re-install is the only real option now tbh.
Im going to buy a new soundcard - an Audigy Z2S or similar. Thats my final attempt. If I still get the CTD Ill reformat etc...
Cheers. :)
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Eagle have you tired it with just one stick of the new Ram in???? sry if I missed it in the thread :P
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Hi Shaun
If you could convince me why this would make a difference, I might try it. :)
Ive now installed a brand new Audigy 4 soundcard - CTD. :(
Ive removed the USB Modem before playing - CTD.
On reboot, I encountered a BSOD.
0x0000008E (0xC0000005, 0x8054A95B, 0xAD669B4C, 0x00000000)
Im at my wits end... :(
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sometimes it does, thats why :p
why do you think adding a new sound card will help if it still crashes with the current one removed ?
if your woried about drivers etc.. like you said earlier, remove the card, boot up in safe mode and remove the drivers.
(in safe mode itll show you all the drivers, in normal boot they wont be there because the cards not isntalled)
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Is having two sticks of RAM bad for the system and gaming?
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Is having two sticks of RAM bad for the system and gaming?
no
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So if just one stick works, Im pretty stuffed....
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What slot shall I leave the stick in? And Ill have to change the BIOS settings as its running at DDR 400 at the mo. What do I do?
:)
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So if just one stick works, Im pretty stuffed....
not stuffed just enlightened. Just check it out as you have nowt to lose.
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What slot shall I leave the stick in? And Ill have to change the BIOS settings as its running at DDR 400 at the mo. What do I do?
:)
try all the slots in turn. leave the ram settings as they are
after trying the one stick in all the slots then try the next stick of ram too
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Try upping the ram voltage to 2.8
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Heh, I dont get though - whatll it prove when Ive already tested the RAM and everythings running ok?... :?:
:)
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itll tell us its not that if it passes :D
seriously though, it is something you should do as a matter routine checking.
Pointless speculating that the ram is OK if you dont actually test it
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Sorry, I thought thats what memtest did?...
:gag: :?: :D
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memtest just tells you the memory is ok, still doesent mean theres not a problem there somewhere tho :o
tbh i think its probably a software thing, and you need to format re-install, it just depends how your system is set up and how easy it is to wipe it then get it back to the way you like it ;)
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its such a simple test and once its done you either know or rule it out :roll:
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Eagle as I said on page 1
There is also a issue with later NF7-S with the Memory controller, as suggested try 1 stick of Ram, if that solves it then it is most likely a Mobo issue, seeing you have new Ram.
So just put one stick in slot 1 and see if it still falls over.
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:)
One thing Ive just noticed. It might have a bearing but I doubt it. Ill mention it anyway...
I had an external drives USB connector plugged into the 1394 network socket in the PC (couldnt have been concentrating when I put it together!). The drive has been switched off (on stand-by) since installation but could it have caused a conflict?
Ill have another quick test with that connected properly and then its format/reinstall time. :mrgreen:
Tbvfh, its long overdue anyway - my systems had a hard time since last fresh install. Ill feck around with the memory post-reinstall if that doesnt work. Im hoping it will because itll kill two birds with one stone. :)
Cheers so far. :)
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Dude I would do it first, it would only take a minute to take a stick of Ram out :P
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Ok, doing that first. :) Each stick in all three slots, right?
Six reboots, six tests and I have to remove the graphics card every time coz its such a big boy and it covers the lugs!
I may be some time...
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:shock: Lol no! you just had to test one stick in the 1st slot :P :D
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:shock: Lol no! you just had to test one stick in the 1st slot :P :D
no hes right. thats what he should do
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Vouching here for the gayness of the slots in the nf7-s v2.
I have to remove my hsf assembly and my graphics card just to gain access to them. Bloody things.
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:shock: Lol no! you just had to test one stick in the 1st slot :P :D
no hes right. thats what he should do
Not for testing the Memory controller on the Mobo it isnt.
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testing defferent slots is better tho, migth ahve a bad slot / something connected to that slot thats bad / bad connection somewhere :dunno:
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:shock: Lol no! you just had to test one stick in the 1st slot :P :D
no hes right. thats what he should do
Not for testing the Memory controller on the Mobo it isnt.
what???? yes it is
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Lol - I see you guys have been having fisti-cuffs while I been away! :D
Heres the results of the testing. Tbh, Im p*ssed off with the whole thing and didnt get as far as all six tests! (I did 4 + Dual Channel again) :lol:
Memory stick (1) in Slot 1: Ok Boot/Ok Game (Gametime 45 mins)
Memory stick (1) in Slot 2: Ok Boot/Ok Game (Gametime 45 mins)
Memory stick (1) in Slot 3: Ok Boot/CTD Game (Gametime 30 mins)
Memory stick (2) in Slot 3: Ok Boot/Ok Game (Gametime 1hr 10mins)
Hunch at this point...
Inserts Mem (1) into slot 2 with (2) in slot 3 (Dual Channel again): Ok Boot/BSOD with sound loop after 90mins.
I reckon this is fairly inconclusive and I still dont think this is a memory/slot issue. Why would memory stick (1) in slot 3 produce a CTD and mem (2) not?...
Over to the experts again... :)
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brummie Before I stopped using Abit boards out of a batch of 10 NF7s 4 had faulty memory controllers and I had 2 others before then.
So I do know how to diagnose the problem ;)
Edit: Eagle what I would do if I was you is just use one of the 1 Gig sticks in the 1st slot and just run it for a few days,
if it runs ok I would say its the boards memory controller not able to cope with more than 1 stick of Ram, but if it still falls over it could still be a Windows prob.
Annoying problems like these can take ages to diagniose :(
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...what I would do if I was you is just use one of the 1 Gig sticks in the 1st slot and just run it for a few days,
if it runs ok I would say its the boards memory controller not able to cope with more than 1 stick of Ram
Ah! But I ran two sticks of 512Mb in Dual thingy before this latest upgrade - and the problem was exactly the same! :)
Its a Windows thing... Im sure of it. :)
Too bolloxed to reformat/reinstall tonight but thats the next phase as theres nothing else now I can try.
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Thats why Im saying only use 1 stick rather than 2, if it runs fine with only 1 for a few days
you will know its not Windows causing the prob and save having to reinstall without being 100% sure you need to :)
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Its overdue anyway so probably worth a try at least. If anything, the fragmented files cant be helping matters. :(
Other thingss Ive considered:
Although the memory is designed to run at CAS 2, could I make it run at 2.5 or even 3? Would that affect performance significantly?
What if I adjust the page file? Currently:
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y102/pbr/pgef.jpg)
What about sytem restore? On or Off?
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Cas only affects the very first access cycle so you wont notice any difference
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Cas only affects the very first access cycle so you wont notice any difference
Page file is fine and shouldnt intefere in any way
System restore is OK. Does hog resources but shouldnt affect anything.
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Wakes up
Yawns
reaches for Windows CD... :(
:mrgreen:
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Lol - still ere!
I noticed that when I just had one stick in, the mobo reported that it was running at 400DDR - thats the Dual Channel setting isnt it? Will that damage the RAM and is it possible to run the memory at 400DDR in non-dual channel?... i.e. in slots 1 and 2 (3 being the slot which produced a CTD).
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400DDR just means 400MHz Double Data Rate, nothing to do with Dual Channel.
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So I can still rate them at 400DDR? Just not dual channel?
Will I lose much performance?
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Dual channel only works in slots 1 and 3 on the NF7, you will loose a bit of performance but not that you would notice outside of benchmarks tbh.
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wait a min.... you had the problems before the upgrade ? I thought they were new after the upgrade :o
that points away from the windows fault (a bit anyway)
from your mempry tests Id say it is a memory issue.
stick A is ok in slot 1 and 2, CTD in slot 3
stick B is ok in slot 3
A in 2, B in 3, BSOD
you need to test it a bit more, try leaving sick B in slot 3 for a few days, make sure its deffo. ok
try the sticks in slots 1 and 2
dual channel makes naff all real difference tbh.
either youve got an iffy stick of ram, or slot 3 is iffy.
what if you go back to your old ram ?
if it still does it then, then its the slot.
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Dual channel only works in slots 1 and 3 on the NF7, you will loose a bit of performance but not that you would notice outside of benchmarks tbh.
2 and 3 as well (1 stick just needs to be in 3) :)
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wait a min.... you had the problems before the upgrade ? I thought they were new after the upgrade :o
:)
that points away from the windows fault (a bit anyway)
TBC... ;)
dual channel makes naff all real difference tbh.
Thats what I wanted to hear. :) What I think Ill do is whack the sticks in 1 and 2, avoiding 3. See what happens. (I previously had them in 2 and 3)
I take it then, that Ican still run them at 400DDR?... :)
Cheers. :)
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I take it then, that Ican still run them at 400DDR?... :)
Cheers. :)
yes
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Fresh reinstall! :w00t:
Still CTDing... :disappointed:
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:( Have you tired what I suggested of just having a stick of Ram in slot 1 yet?
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:( Have you tired what I suggested of just having a stick of Ram in slot 1 yet?
Yup :)
try the sticks in slots 1 and 2
That too.
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id strip the system right down, give all the slots etc. a good blow to make sure theres no dust in there anywhere then rebuild.
it that doesent fix it, then Id say you need a new m/b :(
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Hmm. Nightmare.
What about the PCI/Busmastering issue - we didnt quite agree on the way forward on that one. On of off?
Others have suggested its a heat issue but I dont think so - Tomb Raider: Legend CTDd (consistently) within the first couple of minutes. SWBFII (cranked way high) lasted anything up to two hours. Oh, and it occasionally crashes when in Windows too. So, no; it cant be heat.
Thinking about using just the one stick again - if it works, its a workaround - but Id be pretty miffed as Ive just forked out £100+ on a new pair. :(
Bleedin pooters... :evil:
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Hmm. Nightmare.
What about the PCI/Busmastering issue - we didnt quite agree on the way forward on that one. On of off?
Others have suggested its a heat issue but I dont think so - Tomb Raider: Legend CTDd (consistently) within the first couple of minutes. SWBFII (cranked way high) lasted anything up to two hours.
Bleedin pooters... :evil:
cant see BM being the problem but just rty it any way
Did you up the RAM voltage?
You also really need to try a different PSU
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Heres my current state:
Settings:
CPU Core Voltage: 1.65v
DDR SDRAM Voltage: 2.6v
Chipset Voltage: 1.6v
AGP Voltage: 1.5v
PSU Actuals (fluctuations etc):
CPU: 1.63 to 1.64v
VCC Voltage: 2.64v
I/O Voltage: 3.28 to 3.34v
+5: 5.02 to 5.05v
+12: 11.97 to 12.03v
-12: 12.11 to 12.19
-5: 5.5v
3.3 Dual Voltage: 3.56 to 3.58v
I also noticed that the SATA Controller was enabled and SATA RAID ROM was enabled also - I take it it wont hurt to disable them (I use IDE)?
PCI Latency Timer: 32 Clock(s)
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According to the RAM spec sheet:
"Test Voltage [size=24]2.75v[/size]" :roll:
Havent tested it yet.
Still doesnt explain though why the old setup had the same problem. Perhaps the voltages might have been wrong for them too!
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Research reveals the old RAM should have been running at 2.7volts...
We juuuust might be on to something here! :)
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...
Nope.
I changed the voltage to 2.7 (the only increment the BIOS would allow) and I was able to play for 10 mins before it rebooted. Hmm. Rebooted - thats not happened before...
It was also on a continual reboot too. It would get just past the Welcome screen and into Windows then reboot continuously. So the voltage is now back down to 2.6...
Grrrr. :evil:
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...
Nope.
I changed the voltage to 2.7 (the only increment the BIOS would allow) and I was able to play for 10 mins before it rebooted. Hmm. Rebooted - thats not happened before...
It was also on a continual reboot too. It would get just past the Welcome screen and into Windows then reboot continuously. So the voltage is now back down to 2.6...
Grrrr. :evil:
have you updated your BIOS???
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what was that you mentioned about a firewire port / drive connected to a usb header?
did you sort that out?
90% sure it wont be the problem but still if you know somethings wrong its best to cure it.
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what was that you mentioned about a firewire port / drive connected to a usb header?
did you sort that out?
90% sure it wont be the problem but still if you know somethings wrong its best to cure it.
It was simply that Id "connected" a firewire lead into a 1394 socket. The device wasnt powered so there shouldnt have been a problem. Removed now and still, the problem persists. :(
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have you updated your BIOS???
Ill be attempting that in minutes few. :)
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Done.
Now for some gametime. :)
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good luck
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Thinking about using just the one stick again - if it works, its a workaround - but Id be pretty miffed as Ive just forked out £100+ on a new pair. :(
Bleedin pooters... :evil:
Id go back down to one stick, it wont make that much difference in the short tearm, and itll help us identify the problem if that fixes it :)
...just to clarify..... the system was stable and good ? started having these problems, then you upgraded, and the problems are still there ?
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...just to clarify..... the system was stable and good? started having these problems, then you upgraded, and the problems are still there ?
My systemss always been pretty rock-solid in Windows. Ive not been able to play games though since X3: Reunion came out.
Ive seen massive benefits with the upgrade - especially the graphics card - but the old game crashing problem still exists. :)
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Bugger. After the BIOS update, system crashes during gaming and reboots. :(
But, I finally get some sense out of Microsoft:
=========================
Error caused by a video device driver :shock: :shock: :shock:
Thank you for sending an error report to Microsoft.
Error report summary
Error type Windows stop error (A message appears on a blue screen with error code information)
Solution available? Yes
What does this error mean? You received this message because a device driver installed on your computer caused the Windows operating system to stop unexpectedly. This type of error is referred to as a "stop error." A stop error requires you to restart your computer.
Cause A video adapter device driver
Computer symptoms A message appears on a blue screen with error code information:
STOP 0x000000EA THREAD_STUCK_IN_DEVICE_DRIVER
- or -
STOP: 0x100000EA THREAD_STUCK_IN_DEVICE_DRIVER_M
Action for you to take
We have analyzed your error report and there are two solutions for this problem for you to choose between.
+ Solution 1: Install the most current driver for your video card
yadda yadda...
+ Solution 2: Manually decrease Hardware Acceleration for your video adapter
This procedure prevents the display driver from programming the hardware incorrectly, but you may lose some display functionality and performance. Although you can increase the hardware acceleration settings higher than None to regain functionality and performance, these settings increase the chance that the issue will occur again. For maximum stability, leave hardware acceleration turned off.
Note: This procedure prevents the display driver from programming the hardware incorrectly, but you may lose some display functionality and performance. Although you can increase the hardware acceleration settings higher than None to regain functionality and performance, these settings increase the chance that the issue will occur again. For maximum stability, leave hardware acceleration off.
Article ID : 11
Last Review : February 28, 2006
Revision : 1.0
Additional Technical Information
Error Message: STOP 0x000000EA THREAD_STUCK_IN_DEVICE_DRIVER (Q293078)
===================
Errr.... :shock:
+ Solution 1: Install the most current driver for your video card
Ive already done that...
So which driver out of the millions available shall I go with?...
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Is Sideband Addressing enabled in BIOS??? If it is disable it.
Have you got the latest DirectX installed???
Try a older Omega driver from the archive http://www.omegadrivers.net/ (6.1 or 6.2)
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Is Sideband Addressing enabled in BIOS??? If it is disable it.
Dont think I have that in mine?... :?
Have you got the latest DirectX installed???
First thing I did. :)
Try a older Omega driver from the archive http://www.omegadrivers.net/ (6.1 or 6.2)
Ill try one. I know to use DriverCleaner too so no worries on that score. ;)
Hang on... arent they drivers for Radeon/ATI Cards?
I still get the feeling it isnt driver-related (what caused the continual reboot?...) - but if thats what its suggesting...
:)
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Ignore the 6.1 or 6.2 that was me being a nub :P but there is Nvidia drivers as well.
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:D
Still dont know which one? [spinning eyes] :) lol
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http://www.ngohq.com/home.php?page=Files&go=cat&dwn_cat_id=26 get nVidia Omega Driver 1.6177
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Tried crippling the ram yet? Set it to cas3, 266mhz and give it a spin.
Can you put the rad back in and look at any error messages you get, or can you try the ram & cards in another system?
Temps ok?
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Tried crippling the ram yet? Set it to cas3, 266mhz and give it a spin.
Could be worth trying but remember that my old RAM was running at safe timings and the problems were just the same. Thats the hook here - the new hardware is experiencing the same problems as the old. :)
Can you put the rad back in and look at any error messages you get, or can you try the ram & cards in another system?
Too little time Im afraid. :(
Temps ok?
IIRC, the CPU temp is around 52 deg or so (straight after gaming). Warm, but not so blisteringly hot as to cause so many crashes. Besides some crashes/freezes/BSODs are happening hours into a game.
Ive now tried running one stick in slot one (again) and it crashed this time within a few minutes. Therefore, Im now inclined to think that it could be something to do with a background event. Some prog or something trying to do something thats pulling the rug from under the CPU and/or memory. Just generally being annoying in a Windows stylee... :roll:
Heres what I have running when gaming:
Red indicates what I can successfully shut down/stop before starting a game. The ones left alone are those that either I cant shut down or wont because I dont know whether I should...
McSheild and CTHELPER definitely wont stop.
CAN I run games from Safe Mode?... What about creating a new user with F-all going on in the background? How would I acheive that? :)
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y102/pbr/bgserv1.jpg)
:)
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You cant run games in Safe mode but you can run with the minimum amount running.
Type msconfig into run box, then under Services tab put a tick in hide all Microsoft services, then turn everything off that hasnt got Nvidia as the Manufacturer and your sound card, then all off under Startup tabs except Nvidia again and your soundcard then reboot.
Tbh I dont think it will help Im about 80% sure its your mobo and the other 20% could be your PSU so I think you need to try a different PSU if you can.
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Cheers. :)
Fair cop on the mobo but out of interest, what makes you think its the PSU? (550W Enermax).
Settings again:
http://www.tekforums.co.uk/posts/list/75/761.page#10031
If it came to it, and I had to install a new mobo, would I have to reinstall Windows?... :shock:
:)
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The voltages look fine there, but seeing the problems you had when you put the volts up on the Ram it could be PSU related,
so better testing that before you get a new mobo and IMO there the only 2 things left it could be with everything thing else you have done lol :P .
If it is the mobo you best bet I think would be to try and get a second-hand NF7.
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Yup, you can put the xp disk in after swapping the mainboard, choose install new but when it detects your existing install itll say hey I can sort that out," and you click repair and itll sort itself out.
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Cost of cheap motherboard & 50p ebugger psu for testing + spares drawer: £peanuts
Time taken farting around & staring at laras boobs waiting for a crash: hours n hours
Put a price on your time - throwing money at stuff like this is the best thing to do.
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have you treid the other thing they sugested ? turning down video acceleration ?
right click on the desktop / properties / settings tab / advanced / trouble shoot
never know, it might make a difference, and it all helps narrow down the fault ;)
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If it is the mobo you best bet I think would be to try and get a second-hand NF7.
Might try that anyway. :)
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Put a price on your time - throwing money at stuff like this is the best thing to do.
You nailed it there! Thats the way I usually solve things because I lose more money than I spend when my systems not running tickety-boo!
Probably lost about £800 already since last friday in lost sales, fannying around with this! :roll: :mrgreen:
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have you treid the other thing they sugested ? turning down video acceleration ?
On the list! :)
Cheers, all. :)
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Turning down the sound hardware acceleration in DXDiag has made a significant difference. :D A well documented fix too.
Testing hasnt been exhaustive but Ill try some more tomorrow when I get TR: Legend. Again... :/
Do these settings affect sound quality in Windows as well as games?
:)
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Anyone? :)
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Anyone? :)
why u using a sound card and not the onboard?
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I only found that fix worked when the sound card was sharing a IRQ, that why I suggested moving the cards PCI slot earlier in the thread.
So have a look under system Information to see if it is sharing one.
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Anyone? :)
why u using a sound card and not the onboard?
I dunno - I read somewhere that using onboard sound is poo and causes problems too! :whoops: ;)
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I only found that fix worked when the sound card was sharing a IRQ, that why I suggested moving the cards PCI slot earlier in the thread.
I did move it to the lowest slot but Ive also read elsewhere that it should be near the top? :shock:
So have a look under system Information to see if it is sharing one.
Just says IRQ 18... :?:
Oh, ang on.....
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Conflicts/Sharing:
I/O Port 0x00000000-0x00000CF7 PCI bus
I/O Port 0x00000000-0x00000CF7 Direct memory access controller
I/O Port 0x000003C0-0x000003DF NVIDIA nForce2 AGP Host to PCI Bridge
I/O Port 0x000003C0-0x000003DF NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GS
IRQ 21 Standard Enhanced PCI to USB Host Controller
IRQ 21 OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller
Memory Address 0xD0000000-0xDFFFFFFF NVIDIA nForce2 AGP Host to PCI Bridge
Memory Address 0xD0000000-0xDFFFFFFF NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GS
Memory Address 0xE4000000-0xE6FFFFFF NVIDIA nForce2 AGP Host to PCI Bridge
Memory Address 0xE4000000-0xE6FFFFFF NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GS
Memory Address 0xA0000-0xBFFFF PCI bus
Memory Address 0xA0000-0xBFFFF NVIDIA nForce2 AGP Host to PCI Bridge
Memory Address 0xA0000-0xBFFFF NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GS
I/O Port 0x000003B0-0x000003BB NVIDIA nForce2 AGP Host to PCI Bridge
I/O Port 0x000003B0-0x000003BB NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GS
I/O Port 0x0000C000-0x0000DFFF PCI standard PCI-to-PCI bridge
I/O Port 0x0000C000-0x0000DFFF Creative SB Audigy 4 (WDM)
IRQs:
IRQ 0 System timer OK
IRQ 1 Standard 101/102-Key or Microsoft Natural PS/2 Keyboard OK
IRQ 3 Communications Port (COM2) OK
IRQ 4 Communications Port (COM1) OK
IRQ 5 NVIDIA nForce PCI System Management OK
IRQ 8 System CMOS/real time clock OK
IRQ 9 Microsoft ACPI-Compliant System OK
IRQ 12 PS/2 Compatible Mouse OK
IRQ 13 Numeric data processor OK
IRQ 14 Primary IDE Channel OK
IRQ 15 Secondary IDE Channel OK
IRQ 18 Creative SB Audigy 4 (WDM) OK
IRQ 19 NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GS OK
IRQ 20 Standard OpenHCD USB Host Controller OK
IRQ 21 Standard Enhanced PCI to USB Host Controller OK
IRQ 21 OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller OK
IRQ 22 Standard OpenHCD USB Host Controller OK
Mean anything to you?
:)
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That looks perfectly normal
And onboard is ok. nothing wrong with it, especially compared to an Audigy
Might wanna try APIC mode disabled as you aint got a multiprocessor system. - needs reinstall to do
While your at it i remember a fix for the NF7
When youve loaded your OS goto the device manager and change the driver for system to Advanced configoration and Power Interface PC
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That looks perfectly normal
And onboard is ok. nothing wrong with it, especially compared to an Audigy
Lol - did I mess up buying the Audigy? :D
http://forums.creative.com/creativelabs/board/message?board.id=soundblaster&message.id=21230&view=by_date_ascending&page=1
Seems Im not alone... :roll:
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edited my post
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Lol - did I mess up buying the Audigy? :D
http://forums.creative.com/creativelabs/board/message?board.id=soundblaster&message.id=21230&view=by_date_ascending&page=1
Seems Im not alone... :roll:
nah, youll sort it in the end. just try the onboard though as you have it
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Might wanna try APIC mode disabled as you aint got a multiprocessor system. - needs reinstall to do
Sorry - wheres that? :)
While your at it i remember a fix for the NF7
When youve loaded your OS goto the device manager and change the driver for system to Advanced configoration and Power Interface PC
Thats already done (but I never did it!) :D
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nah, youll sort it in the end. just try the onboard though as you have it
I might try that if the total disable of sound hardware acceleration doesnt work. Thing is; where would I connect meh speakers?.... :)
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Sorry - wheres that? :)
In the bios
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I might try that if the total disable of sound hardware acceleration doesnt work. Thing is; where would I connect meh speakers?.... :)
In the back of the PC where the keyboard etc plug in :D
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Sorry - wheres that? :)
In the bios
Reinstall of Win or the soundcard? :)
I might try that if the total disable of sound hardware acceleration doesnt work. Thing is; where would I connect meh speakers?.... :)
In the back of the PC where the keyboard etc plug in :D
Duhh! Never notice them b4! :whoops: :mrgreen:
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it would require windows to be reinstalled :(
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Things just went from bad to worse. :(
I uninstalled all the drivers for the Creative Audigy POS and removed the card.
Then I went into BIOS an enabled onboard sound.
Ive now tried to connect my speakers (Boston Digital BA735) but theres no suitable connection on the back of the board... see below.
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y102/pbr/snd.gif)
:( :cry:
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eh? how do they connect to the SB card?
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eh? how do they connect to the SB card?
Im using onboard sound now.
Ok, solved that by using the analog connector. Sounds like sh*t though and I cant control the sound quality through the usual Windows sound interface thingy... :(
Is there any way to use the digital connection?...
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u installed the drivers and utility for the onboard?
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utility for the onboard?
es a bit of a genius, our brummie! :mrgreen:
Played around with stuff. Not as good sound as digital (I think) - but workable I guess. :)
Now for the biggie - whether onboard sound will solve the issue with the gaming... :shock:
:)
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good luck
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I bet it wont lol :P
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Well....
IT DOES!
Right, firstly:
[size=36]#*$%[/size][/b] Creative and the horse they road in on. Grr! :evil: :evil: :evil:
Now that thats off my chest. ;)...
Tomb Raider: Legend usually crashed within 45-60 seconds (every time without fail). Now I can get at least an hour+ out of it. Aint Next Gen graphics great?! :mrgreen:
Yes, it does still crash but in a different way now (black screen but with sound and game engine still apparently running) which Im confident this time will be a graphics card driver issue (currently running 84.43s). Ill try to get the error report next time.
Sound hardware acceleration is still at full tilt with the onboard sound so Ive yet to explore that option.
Oh, and Ive yet to patch it. :)
Phew! Were getting there.
And PC World will be getting a returned POS sound card tomorrow. :thumbdown:
Ill keep yuz up to date with progress - cheers!ÂÂ
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did you format the other day ?
(a few days back)
if you did, and you havent installed too much again yet, Id do it again :o
might as well, weve been messing around with a load of options that might come back to bite you in the ass :o
a format now the sound issue if fixed should see it running 100% :D
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did you format the other day ?
(a few days back)
U-huh. :)
might as well, weve been messing around with a load of options that might come back to bite you in the ass :o
a format now the sound issue if fixed should see it running 100% :D
:cry: :cry: :cry:
Everything seems fine - can you think of what settings were changed that might affect it? :)
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leave it for a bit to see how it gets on. Dont rush it.
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A 2 hours sesh later and TR:L is running fine with all settings maxxed-out. :mrgreen:
...all is well with not a crash in sight! :)
Well, we got there in the end - thanks for everyones help! :)
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*pops the cork on some bubbly* :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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its a pity the old forums went down, im prety sure this would win the longest problem fixing thread in history :o
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Grats on getting it sorted :D
But I do think the problem lies with the motherboard seeing you had the same problem with 2 sound cars which have different chips.
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...and two Graphics Cards and two sets of RAM...
Anyway, the problem is back with a vengeance... :cry:
Latest things Ive tried:
ADSL Modem off
Turned off fast writes
PCI Latency 64
AGP Latency to 64
x4 AGP
RAM CAS Latency to 2.5
Disabled Serial Ports in BIOS
Changed Mouse from PS2 to USB Connection
Tried a myriad Video drivers
I think theres little else I can do now but replace the mobo... :( But why would it have gone tits in the first place? Theres no other symptoms and otherwise, the system is stable.
NF7-S v2.0, all fine and dandy but are there any other suggestions for an AGP board before I commit? :)
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i would try a different PSU first TBH
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Any recs? (Currently have a decent Enermax 550W)
Money no object. :) What size will I need (whats all this ATX 2.0 lark? :D)
Why do think its the PSU? (Not questioning your knowledge - just interested). :)
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Any recs? (Currently have a decent Enermax 550W)
Money no object. :) What size will I need (whats all this ATX 2.0 lark? :D)
Why do think its the PSU? (Not questioning your knowledge - just interested). :)
Seen it happen loads before, even i had it.
maybe worth trying a PSU if you can rather than buying one straight off.
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Oh, go on - a new one cant hurt. Spec me up! :D
Im also reading stuff about enabling/disabling APIC Mode in the BIOS. The option is available to me - y sure I cant do it without a reinstall? :)
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Oh, go on - a new one cant hurt. Spec me up! :D
Im also reading stuff about enabling/disabling APIC Mode in the BIOS. The option is available to me - y sure I cant do it without a reinstall? :)
dont just waste money on a PSU, ill have it :D
its quite strange as enermax are damn fine PSUs TBH
You can just change it in the bios but windows needs a reinstall to adjust to the new settings. Dont think its gonna cure your ills though but you never know.
Youll get lots of advice as to which PSU.
I have a Akasa Ultra Quiet 400W Paxpower Active and i never have any problems with the spec in my sig (which is close to your old spec isnt it?)
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Is there any way of stress testing a PSU in Windows? :)
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is it an old mobo eagle ???
check the caps, ive had two dead mobos with blown / bulging caps
http://images.google.co.uk/images?q=blown%20motherboard%20capacitors&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&sa=N&tab=wi
usually the major ones round the mosfets show failure first.
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is it an old mobo eagle ???
NF7-S V2.0 - around 2/3 years old.
check the caps, ive had two dead mobos with blown / bulging caps
The mobo is the picture of health. Clean and not a bulge/leak in sight...
:)
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is say its not the PSU and its the M/B
sounds like m/b problems to me, plus... its an enermax ! they last forever ! youre too big, but in the event of a nuclear war you could hide a small pet inside there to save him from the nuclear blast ! AND!!!!! if he stays in there a while it would protect him from the radiation too !
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:lol:
Oh nos - meh system just froze... in Windows :shock: - completely locked up... had to hard reboot.
:(
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its weird that removing the sound card fixed it for a while, and properly fixed it, not just releaved some of the symptoms...
double check everything is plugged in good and tight ;)
id do a full strip and re-build before I bought the new m/b.... just incase (its suprising how many times this fixes things!)
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I had an Enermax psu which lasted fine for three or four years, and then gave no end of intermittent problems, only diagnosed by replacing everything in the pc.....sound familiar? :lol: It got replaced by the Tagan 420.
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Cheers.
Soul-destroying this is.... because I know my spec is more than good enough to run my games. :(
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Damn... Im just convinced its a sound issue. Games most often crash when there is gunfire of some description.
Installing ALC650 AC97 Audio CODECs (Apr 06)... dont know why - just desperate now. :(
Id also like to test the hard drive(s) with Powermax.iso but I cant get it to run on boot (from CD). Justs says:
No swap space!
A:\
A:\
:?:
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I have known a few newish Enermaxs go in my time.
Eagle look at my pervious post about your PSU ;)
http://www.tekheads.co.uk/s/product?product=603612
*Sigh* I would have given up trying to troubleshoot that system long ago, wish you had decided to upgrade 8 pages ago or something lol :p
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I know, I know :) ... but you know how it is. ;)
Tbh, Id rather the (failing(?) component would just explode and be done with it - at least then Id know what was up. :lol:
Theres little I can do at the moment so I just keep on plugging away. Im running an XP3000+ CPU which is pretty old by todays standards. I thought: what if its just being stressed to the limit (by modern games) and its getting too hot? Its my understanding though that overheats usually just cause reboots (not CTDs/lockups) - correct me if Im wrong?...
So, I cranked up the rheostat on the CPU cooler and ran it at full chat for another session. And, sure enough... no crashes!
So Im now thinking that maybe a re-seat is on the cards and some modern day coolage? Running an Aero 7+ at the moment. What do you think? Do the symptoms check out with a hot CPU? Maybe Ill run with the maxxed cooler for a few more sessions and see if it pans-out.
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y102/pbr/4aef01c3.gif) (http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y102/pbr/4aef01c3.gif) (http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y102/pbr/367c52c0.jpg)
:D
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tbh my 4 year old enermax has just been replaced although i could see the rails where well outta spec on it using speedfans readings.
itd crap out and reboot playing anything 3d due to extra load put on it while the radeon started drawing proper current.
could do with something that could log the rail voltages while playing games,
see if they dip randomly before lockup :?:
oh yes over heating can cause lockups and not just random reboots.
got any temp readings? it should be able to read the xp3200s diode.
i get worried if the diode on mine hits 60oC although it should be good till at least 65 before crapping out in the past from when i was playing about clocking it.
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i get worried if the diode on mine hits 60oC although it should be good till at least 65 before crapping out in the past from when i was playing about clocking it.
LOL i cry if mines hits 40. Feelin i may bit a bit OTT :P
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Latest:
Two mega-sessions on Tomb Raider (with graphics at full-tilt) and no crashes.
...and Ive reinstalled the Audigy because I just couldnt live with the pooey quality of the (Desktop) music. :D And still no crashes!
Ill crank up the RAM to 2.7 volts again in due course... when Im feeling brave again. :D
I also enabled APIC mode. See http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/2006/01/04/bios_from_a_to_z1/page10.html
So, it looks like a CPU cooling issue after all. (After all that!)
Im setting mself up for a fall again, arent I? :roll: Just wanted to keep you guys up to date, seeing as youve been so helpful.
Id like to install a monster CPU Cooler - got any recs for a Socket A board. Few and far between now, Im guessing. :(
PS: Ill be buying a spare NF7-S v2.0 anyway - before they disappear altogether.
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Latest:
Two mega-sessions on Tomb Raider (with graphics at full-tilt) and no crashes.
...and Ive reinstalled the Audigy because I just couldnt live with the pooey quality of the (Desktop) music. :D And no crashes!
So, it looks like a CPU cooling issue after all. (After all that!)
Im setting mself up for a fall again, arent I? :roll: Just wanted to keep you guys up to date, seeing as youve been so helpful.
Id like to install a monster CPU Cooler - got any recs for a Socket A board. Few and far between now, Im guessing. :(
PS: Ill be buying a spare NF7-S v2.0 anyway - before they disappear altogether.
touch wood quick :D
I use the ThermalRight SI-97 with a fan running at 1600rpm so its wisper quiet :D
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Looks good. How do you mount a fan on that?
:)
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Looks good. How do you mount a fan on that?
:)
It clips on quite loosley with spring clips but there is no chance the fan will fall off. very goo heatsink. Oh and BTW i use the 92mm fan to make it more air flow to keep the RPM down :D
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Here a pic of the temps etc for my system
(http://www.brummie.me.uk/old/uploads/sf1.jpg)
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Does the fan you use (Panoflo?) have a rheo? :)
By the way, dya like my wiring? :shock: :roll: :lol:
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y102/pbr/wrng.jpg)
Well, she is rather old now (note dust). Components do get a blast of air every now and then though. ;) :)
- Out fan at the back held on by 1 3/4 inch woodscrews, picture hooks and duct tape!
- Cable tidying courtesy of Scotch 3M. :D
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Fan is a Zalman quiet thing.
Ill get some pics up of mine but cant be arsed tonight as id have to pull evrything out :(
Why do you plug the CD into the sound card?? Thats so not done anymore :D
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i thought mine was bad :shock:
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Why do you plug the CD into the sound card?? Thats so not done anymore :D
Lol - I dunno - Im a graphic designer not a tekhead! :D :P Hence all the Qs. :) Where should it go?...
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i thought mine was bad :shock:
Heheh, I thought itd raise a laugh.
Im thinking of getting one of those Tagan bad boys, just so I can minimise the amount of spag-bol comming out of the box! :)
Im actually quite fond of my system though (how sad is that?! :D) When she runs ok that is... ;)
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Why do you plug the CD into the sound card?? Thats so not done anymore :D
Lol - I dunno - Im a graphic designer not a tekhead! :D :P Hence all the Qs. :) Where should it go?...
just leave it out. Its for older systems.
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Why do you plug the CD into the sound card?? Thats so not done anymore :D
Lol - I dunno - Im a graphic designer not a tekhead! :D :P Hence all the Qs. :) Where should it go?...
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XP supports digital sound thingy whatsit. the cd drive reads the sound, and xp passes it along the PCI bus to the soundcard. Still no harm in using a CD Rom audio cable, means your at least compatible with older versions of windows, and other operating systems if ever you fancy a dabble. :)
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Ah, so it goes along the IDE cable? :roll: :mrgreen:
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lol, heat after all of this !
we should have asked you about that earlier tbh, its easy to overlook the things you check without thinking :s
its an easy problem to fix tho :)
depends how you want to do it, I say, if your going to do it you may as well do it right ;)
Is swap that back fan for a 120mil fan instead
the front too if itll fit#
tidy up the wireing for better airflow
new heat sink and fan :)
than you should be sorted :)
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Will do - more/better coolage is next on my list. :) The Aero7 seems to be doing the job cranked up high but, as always, you just want more!
Got any recs yourself on CPU coolers? :)
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You dont need a new heatsink and fan just clean out the one you have.
If it coped with games when you first got it will be able to now :P
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You dont need a new heatsink and fan just clean out the one you have.
If it coped with games when you first got it will be able to now :P
not quite true as modern games are more CPU intensive than some of the older ones
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^^^ he upgraded his cpu not so long ago iirc
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Dont forget global warming too :D
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^^^ he upgraded his cpu not so long ago iirc
wheres it say that in the thread? :P
A Aero 7+ is more than good enough for a moderately OC XP3000+, never mind one running at stock, just clean it out!!!! lol
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^^^ he upgraded his cpu not so long ago iirc
wheres it say that in the thread? :P
A Aero 7+ is more than good enough for a moderately OC XP3000+, never mind one running at stock, just clean it out!!!! lol
I dont think it will tbh, it needs changing for a 3000. icetainl6y wouldnt use one. think of the noise (http://www.compumess.nl/daf/smileys/sm1/schrik.gif)
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...modern games are more CPU intensive than some of the older ones
As Ive found to my cost! :P
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:cry:
...just kidding - all is well... even in 3D! :)
Thanks for all the helpage. :)
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