after bush threw it out a few months ago with his cronies. obviously they begrudge people a decent lifestyle.

source

that is still only Ã,£3.70, very low, going in the right direction i suppose.

Yes it maybe Ã,£3.70 in English but the US economy is not based on GBP, it is based on USD.

Most, if not all items in the US that are forsale in the UK have a direct dollar to pound price. i.e. in the UK its Ã,£2.50, the US will be ~$2.50.

So the US minimum wage of $7.25 is actually a very generous amount.

Quote from: DEViANCEthat is still only Ã,£3.70, very low, going in the right direction i suppose.

Tight fisted Republicans. TBH tho, it is still over 2 dollars an hour more and that is a fairly good increase, when was the last time you got a 35% (ish) payrise? Its about bloody time that this was corrected, the minimum wage in France is around €8 an hour which is still far more than the USA gets... but then again Frances economy is stunted by the Government fisting you if you want to employ someone. Ouch.

Cheers
Tongy

Quote from: NimrodYes it maybe Ã,£3.70 in English but the US economy is not based on GBP, it is based on USD.

Most, if not all items in the US that are forsale in the UK have a direct dollar to pound price. i.e. in the UK its Ã,£2.50, the US will be ~$2.50.

So the US minimum wage of $7.25 is actually a very generous amount.

True, its all relative. Alot of products are cheaper in the USA that is for sure.

I dont understand why republicans merde all over the people that voted them in... mainly low wage earning non-coastal states. Perhaps there is an IQ/states-that-voted-for-bush coefficient.

Cheers
Tongy

$7.25/hr is still awfully low considering that most employers that pay such wages do not offer health insurance. One weeklong illness, and youre homeless on such wages.

Most major cities have a much higher starting wage, tbh, the people getting the really low wages are often invisible workers like home health care providers, and illegal aliens working in meat packing facilities.

Anyway, people are pissing and moaning how theyll not be able to do business with such an increase in cost. Its 99.9% wingnuts that have this opinion. I mean, if you have a BK franchise and have to raise the cost of your lunch special a dollar to stay profitable--Im pretty sure the McDs down the street will as well.

AFAIK, service workers like waiters and pizza delivery guys will still get something like $3/hour, with the rest coming from gratuities. Shameful. A tip should be a tip, not something thats like, "here buddy, hope this covers your wifes medical bills."

Walmart and other retailers that have exploited part timers at low wages will have to raise the cost of bulk sh*tter paper a few pennies, and Americans will absorb the cost w/o even noticing.

Anyway, its about time. Ten years, while congress gave itself several pay raises, is embarrassing. Even Henry Ford, that lovable Jew-hating ultra conservative understood that you need to pay people enough to buy stuff and stimulate the economy, instead of just going into debt.

Should be an amazing year. The house of reps had turned into a cesspool of corruption under GOP rule. Everything from homosexual underage sex scandal, to illegal grafts from lobbyists, to wasting time appeasing the American Christian Taliban, with law passed against stem cell research.

Finally, the grown ups are back in charge. There are a lot of folks over here that say, "but the Democrats are just the same." Which is complete horse hockey. Perhaps thirty years ago. Policy wise Nixon was about as liberal as Clinton in many ways. But these days, the GOP after twelve ruling years, became the long arm of corporate interest and greed, with a really bad white Jesus face taped to the front so Cletus and Brandine would feel compelled to vote for em.

I think minimum wage sucks tbh. If as an employer you can get some mug to do the job for Ã,£/$1p/h then you should be able to do just that. It should be up to the employee to realise that they are being mugged and do something about it.

Capitalism baby, you can poke your socialist ideals

Not having a minimum wage puts pressure on the social services of the state. If you dont provide such services, you end up with nominally democratic, but unstable nations such as you see in South America. There is nothing anti capitalistic about minimum wage or requiring health care for all, indeed, as you want to create consumers along with product.

That doesnt make it "right" though, it just means that it is the currently accepted method for maintaining a population at social ease with one another. Not that it truely works hence all the robberies, muggings, thefts etc.

Id opt for paying out a pitance if it meant I could employe a staff of over zelous security men to protect me and my belongings that I have purchased with all the money saved from not paying minimum wage. muhahaha.

Quote from: NimrodThat doesnt make it "right" though, it just means that it is the currently accepted method for maintaining a population at social ease with one another.

Been reading some Ayn Rand or other drivel lately? Thats straight out of her book of memes.

Quote from: NimrodNot that it truely works hence all the robberies, muggings, thefts etc.

Thats quite facile. There are a multitude of factors that contribute to crime. Keeping the minimum wage too low does make a hard days work pretty unappealing to a lot of kids that choose a hoodlums life.  

I support an international minimum wage. If I purchase a sweater kitted in Bagladesh, I want to be sure the garment worker is paid enough to be above the poverty level in their country.

From a fair wage comes dignity and self worth, and from that comes stability. I dont believe in humans as mere commodity to be traded at the lowest price.

Quote from: maximusotterBeen reading some Ayn Rand or other drivel lately? Thats straight out of her book of memes.

Surprisingly I am quite capable of free thought.

Quote from: maximusotterThats quite facile. There are a multitude of factors that contribute to crime. Keeping the minimum wage too low does make a hard days work pretty unappealing to a lot of kids that choose a hoodlums life.  

Facile ? Surely if we lived in a society where everyones self worth was the same there would be absolutely no need for crimes based on self gain ? Mind you, youd probably find a lot more skivers as if the wealth is shared why would anyone actually do any work?

Quote from: maximusotterI support an international minimum wage. If I purchase a sweater kitted in Bagladesh, I want to be sure the garment worker is paid enough to be above the poverty level in their country.

Why ? Does it mean that the garment is made to a higher quality or comes with bells on ? Why would anyone in their right mind want to pay more than they need to for anything ? I can only assume that you give your excess earnings to charity so that the money can be dished out to the needy.

Quote from: maximusotterFrom a fair wage comes dignity and self worth.

Erm, really ? So if youre not being paid you have no dignity and are in fact worthless ? Personally I dont measure people based on their pay check.

Quote from: maximusotter...and from that comes stability.

Stability ? How so ?
People are rarely happy with the material possessions they have and are always striving for more. The minimum wage does not help as it gives people who should be earning pittance more *disposable* income. This intern leads to them desiring possessions that are now more accessible than they would otherwise be. The person borrows money against their minimum wage to purchase said items. This leads to those people who are more highly paid expecting more for themselves and they begin to run up larger debts in the race to self-actualise. Before you know it the entire economy is hinged on the debt run up by people striving for a life that they  cannot afford.
Without the minimum wage the entire debt level would be reduced as minimum waged workers would not be able to get themselves into as much debt and the Jones would not find themselves taking on more debt attempting to keep up.

Quote from: maximusotterI dont believe in humans as mere commodity to be traded at the lowest price.

Really ? I guess you must be a sole-trader working for yourself, either that or your have won the lottery.

Quote from: NimrodYes it maybe Ã,£3.70 in English but the US economy is not based on GBP, it is based on USD.

Most, if not all items in the US that are forsale in the UK have a direct dollar to pound price. i.e. in the UK its Ã,£2.50, the US will be ~$2.50.

So the US minimum wage of $7.25 is actually a very generous amount.

Sorry but that is a complete pile of balls - yes the cost of living is cheaper (with the exception the poor cant necessarily afford medical costs) however it isnt as though US companies are massively less inefficient that their European counterparts.

If British companies can afford to pay 5.50 per hour or whatever it is over here then so can US companies tbh...

In fact US companies ought to have less overheads - cost of land is cheaper, cost of fuel is cheaper

I dont understand what youre calling balls ?

Are you saying that the US minimum wage should be the same as the UK minimum wage (or visa-versa) ? i.e. Ã,£5 here should mean ~$10 there ? Why would the US and UK rates be linked ?

*confused*

Im not saying that it should be exactly the same as the UK - but there is no reason why a small rise should harm them.

Is Mac Donalds in the UK twice as efficient as Mac Donalds in the US?

Doubt it

there is no reason why they cant increase their wages to 3.70 per hour when identical businesses can still cope with even higher wage bills over here.

All that will happen is a small amount of price inflation in certain service industry sectors/fast food etc.. & a slightly fairer distribution of wealth. Rich poor divide in the US is skewed a lot more than it is in Europe.

Im not a socialist & Ive got no desire to see any form of large scale wealth distribution however I reckon the people at the very bottom of the pile ought to be given a fair shot - aside from that everything else is fair game and healthy competition.

Id even advocate flat tax - but only with the provision that the first 10K that people earn is tax free so as to ensure that people on minimum wage dont get screwed by direct taxation due to a higher portion of their wealth having to be spent on the cost of living.

Im all in favour of capitalism, social mobility & meritocracy - But I dont believe you can create a true meritocracy unless all the basic provisions in terms of housing, healthcare & education are available to the very poorest.

Minimum wage is especially important in the US as they dont have free health care & little provision is made for social housing (not that Im a big fan of state provided housing - but there is a need for it in some areas).

I dont see how the whole American dream can really be a realistic reality for all Americans unless they make a few fundamental changes to both the minimum wage & health care provision.

my balls are itchy.

the majoryity of the guys i speak to on another forums welcome this increase because they are stuck serving sh*t at  mcsh*talds and going to uni at the same time. and they are still pretty much on the edge of being thrown out of their accomodation because its expensive.


i welcome it as well imo.