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Lets say a Dinosaur killer asteroid is going to hit, those looking for one missed and everyones in deep excreta. The asteroid will arrive on the far side of the planet, so there is a  chance of you surviving the impact.

What are you going to do?

1] No use buying frozen food, the electricity will be off in four days and theres no guarantee of a supply after that.
2] Going to the shops is what everyone will be doing, they will probably have sold out.

Id be digging a hole and sorting an oxygen bubble.  The shock wave will be massive - theres a fairly high chance itll hit an ocean and cause a tsunami.

Get yourself underground and make sure you have enough air to last a day while the impact passes.

You could relatively easily sort food and things after but the actual impact could strip most surface structures of the planet, cause massive waves, dust clouds, etc.  On a 4 day time scale Id be worrying about the initial blast not food.


edit: as this is probably for a book Ill expand...  Id get ahold of salt (for food preservation), clean water and any tinned food I had around the flat to take with me.  Id bury several metal dishes (rain water collection and for evaporation to get more salt and clean water back from sea water).  A handful of cutting tools (knife and saws) and my camping gear.  Once that was sorted Id make sure my friends/family/girlfriend were sorted too and offer them space in my hole.  From that point we could probably get to Bronze age level of existance in a very short amount of time even if there was nothing left of the modern world.

In 4 days tho theres enough time to sort a generator and AM transmitter (just because of proximity to work Id probably take their broadcast system).  Petrol out of the car and a decent first aid kit.  If that stuff got sorted as well then theres no reason why you couldnt not only survive but you could probably help a lot of survivors and advance back to the early 1900s.  Youd not have electronics or plastics and would only be able to recylce metal you found but theres going to be lots of that around afterwards.  Wed probably not recover back to the information age for a very very long time as far too many people would die.

Id expect you could be at bronze age again within 6 months tho with enough capable people in one place.

^If society collapsed sorting food would be the hardest thing, aside from not getting killed for your shoes.

Id sort clean water, fishing stuff, sharp sticks, fire, in that order. Then Id hit the library for books. By day 4 Im brewing up hooch for trade purposes.

id probably study how to fly a plane for a couple of days, then work out how i can steal one just before the impact, then id make sure i was at 50,000ft when it hit.

Quote from: DEViANCEid probably study how to fly a plane for a couple of days, then work out how i can steal one just before the impact, then id make sure i was at 50,000ft when it hit.

boom - shockwave lol
Just dont crash on my hole! :D

Id make sure I was in one of those left over nuke bunkers in some old buildings.... theres at elast 1 I know if in newcastle.... thatll do.... get in first and lock the oddr behind me ;)

Quote from: knightyId make sure I was in one of those left over nuke bunkers in some old buildings.... theres at elast 1 I know if in newcastle.... thatll do.... get in first and lock the oddr behind me ;)

yeah there is an old ROC in the field behind my house, its still got its air cleaner and periscope too.

Dinosaur killing asteroid?

Surely then on impact youd be looking at big tsunami thing, vapour or dust cloud obscuring sunlight for a long time, a change in the climate model? Id be tempted to be pessimistic and say were all pretty screwed no matter where we are and just see if I could find a lass who wants to go out with several bangs (scuse the bad pun)

On the assumption it turns out that lets say, england somehow wont get oblitorated due to some freak physical magic...head to a relatively unpopulated rural area and try to become self sufficient. Safest bet probably would be to hope to come across a settlement near an army base, so you can help sort out becoming self-sufficient growing food etc with the protection from the looters that are sure to appear sooner or later.

Alternatively, wait for the impact on the ocean to pass and then grab a boat and live off the sea perhaps. Good source of protein, though most fish would probably be belly up. Mmmm, algae burgers...

http://www.amazon.com/Lucifers-Hammer-Larry-Niven/dp/0449208133

- cool book. Big comet. Smack. Arrrrggghhhh!!! Cannibals. FIIGHT!!

Some whiskey, some water, tins of food, a good rifle and ammo and hope for the best.

go on a killing spree & start the survival early..


Or nick one of those floating forts
http://www.bornrich.org/entry/man-made-no-man-lands-fort-up-for-grab/
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html%3Fin_article_id%3D468609%26in_page_id%3D1770&h=270&w=468&sz=24&hl=en&start=6&um=1&tbnid=k9TSrbHmQRmwhM:&tbnh=74&tbnw=128&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsea%2Bfort%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN

 
...buy a big surfboard.

Quote from: sdphttp://www.amazon.com/Lucifers-Hammer-Larry-Niven/dp/0449208133

- cool book. Big comet. Smack. Arrrrggghhhh!!! Cannibals. FIIGHT!!

That has got to be the best summary I have ever read for a book !

Id kill a load of spides first - mostly joyriders - but then basically anyone wearing their uniform of tracksuits and caps

Then Id hole up in my paranoid moneybags uncles shelter.

Quote from: MarkThen Id hole up in my paranoid moneybags uncles shelter.

Ill arm wrestle you for your place in the shelter...



no wait.... we could play tidily winks to see who gets in ?

Quote from: DEViANCE

Quote from: knightyId make sure I was in one of those left over nuke bunkers in some old buildings.... theres at elast 1 I know if in newcastle.... thatll do.... get in first and lock the oddr behind me ;)

yeah there is an old ROC in the field behind my house, its still got its air cleaner and periscope too.
(Image removed from quote.)

Youre buggered if there is a Tsunami.

IF it hits the sea and creates a tsunami would going underground be a bad idea as it could leak and flood? Or you be trapped as the water either did not or took a long time to disperse?

Going underground would be but if you take an air bubble with you youll be fine.  Itd work just like a diving bell.  i.e. youd be sat in a bubble.

In a tsunami your priorities would/should probably be:
* get off the surface
* get an oxygen supply down with you
* a way of getting warm after

Id get really drunk and try to have a shag before it hit.

Quote from: White GiantId get really drunk and try to have a shag before it hit.

Quite right too.

Id probably flap around trying to get survival things sorted and then think. **** it, drink and shag.
...then knowing my luck, Id survive the initial blast and die of some nasty VD because there is no medicine about :s

Quote from: White GiantId get really drunk and try to have a shag before it hit.

that is very probably the best suggestion so far.


However, personally Id probably be trying to gather a group of people who are "good to have around in a tight spot" and their associated hangers on. Safety in numbers you know. The UK gets hit by a Tsunami, youre about 95% likelyhood dead anyway. If youre still alive in 5 days time, youre going to need food, water, shelter and ways to aquire/keep the above.

In short, I want whatever supplies I can gather in terms of food, water and ammo, plus a decent number of useful people whose skills compliment one another.

Quote from: knighty

Quote from: MarkThen Id hole up in my paranoid moneybags uncles shelter.

Ill arm wrestle you for your place in the shelter...



no wait.... we could play tidily winks to see who gets in ?

lol no probs

He is an idiot - the thing cost as much as a house (Im guessing) - and realistically - when is he ever going to use it

He could do it up and rent it out as a batchelors pad weekend retreat type thing. Either market the soundproofing thing, do themed lock in type stuff ala "The hole" or organise paintball events around it?

So youre all going to dig holes and dive in? What are you going to do without tekforum? How many of you are going to go bonkers down there trying to deal with withdrawal?

TBH White Giant probably gave the best answer, get drunk and have sex.

The real problem seems to be the amount of food and water you need to survive, its going to be many months to several years for the atmosphere to recover. What got the dinosaurs was a near total lack of food and massive temperature swings. Initially cold due to the particulates in the atmosphere and then hot as those fall out and the CO2 takes over, producing a greenhouse effect.

Theres probably going to be some survivors but as to how many and where I dont know. No electricity, gas, fuel or mains water. Very limited, if any, medical supplies. Any frozen food you have will go off in days unless you have a generator to supply power. Technology down the drain.

Tsunamis were mentioned but what about earth quakes? Again all that hot rock going up has to come down somewhere.

Then there is the psychological factors, a lot of people in Hiroshima and Nagasaki ended up wandering aimlessly around due to shock. Expect the same thing.

The question is keeping technology alive, there are some places that could survive a hit on this scale, bunkers and the likes, but will they be ready and have enough resources to cope?

Most people who arent killed outright are going to suffer hypothermia, starve or die of thirst. Even if they do go out they will end up finding most of the water available is contaminated.

Just try working out what the minimum food and water you would need to survive a year is.

I read a couple of books and have watched some related TV programmes in the past. I certainly didnt realise the enormity of the survival problem either. compared to this surviving a global pandemic virus might be relatively easy.

If you didnt go to the shops how long would the food last in your home?

Quote from: SeriousSo youre all going to dig holes and dive in? What are you going to do without tekforum? How many of you are going to go bonkers down there trying to deal with withdrawal?

TBH White Giant probably gave the best answer, get drunk and have sex.

Im just taking my girlfriend and some spares into the hole to survive.  You have sex all the time (lets not dwell on that point) - 4 days off to keep living might be a better use of your time.

QuoteThe real problem seems to be the amount of food and water you need to survive, its going to be many months to several years for the atmosphere to recover. What got the dinosaurs was a near total lack of food and massive temperature swings. Initially cold due to the particulates in the atmosphere and then hot as those fall out and the CO2 takes over, producing a greenhouse effect.

Waters not going to be a problem after the first day tbh.  It may be ice but theres going to be no shortage of the stuff.  If the sun gets blocked out by a dust cloud for years then fair enough with total lack of food but youre pretty much dead on a planet without sun regardless of what you do.  Lasting a couple of months on whats around shouldnt be too difficult.  Theres so much useful stuff lying around the surface of the planet these days - which dinosaurs didnt have.  You could probably burn everything in sight for months for heat without even denting a small towns resources.

QuoteTheres probably going to be some survivors but as to how many and where I dont know. No electricity, gas, fuel or mains water.

Well theres tons to burn on the planet and theres going to be a lot of cars around unused if you really needed diesel/petrol.  Mains waters no problem - sewage shouldnt be a problem and anyone with the skills to survive is going to be able to work out how to knock up an evaporator for drinking water.  If they cant do that or find someone wholl do it for them then theyre probably not worth saving anyway...

QuoteVery limited, if any, medical supplies.

thats going to be the biggest problem but you can get a long way with clean water and hot pieces of metal.

QuoteAny frozen food you have will go off in days unless you have a generator to supply power. Technology down the drain.

Whats your obcession with frozen food?  Salt has been used to preserve food for decades before fridges/freezers.  Thats going to be falling out of sea water like crazy when people are evaporating drinking water.  With even moderate sun light theres going to be plants, animals and fish all over the place.  Let alone the years of food supplies lying around tinned in every city.

QuoteTsunamis were mentioned but what about earth quakes? Again all that hot rock going up has to come down somewhere.

Earthquakes shouldnt be a huge problem tbh.  Its an impact not a tectonic movement.  It seems like a lot of energy being dumped because its happening in a short period of time and on the surface but chances are the strike is actually releasing less energy than the earths plates release every time they crack.

QuoteThen there is the psychological factors, a lot of people in Hiroshima and Nagasaki ended up wandering aimlessly around due to shock. Expect the same thing.

Thats down to the individual - in reality you could probably save a reasonable group of people around you with 4 days planning.

QuoteThe question is keeping technology alive, there are some places that could survive a hit on this scale, bunkers and the likes, but will they be ready and have enough resources to cope?

I know a lot of people whod be able to get irrigation/water and simple mechanical systems back up and running in no time.  Im fairly certain I could get basic electricity for a small group of huts up and running within a month just from scraps of metal on the surface of the planet.  Sub 50V Batteries are very doable within a couple of weeks even with nothing.  Basic radio receiving equipment shouldnt be too difficult to build from that point.

QuoteMost people who arent killed outright are going to suffer hypothermia, starve or die of thirst. Even if they do go out they will end up finding most of the water available is contaminated.

Nope - water really isnt a problem - just boil any water (sea water is fine) and catch the steam.  Itll be pure.  You do however need fire which will be the deciding factor.  Because frankly, you cant light fires using sticks.

QuoteJust try working out what the minimum food and water you would need to survive a year is.

Waters trivial if someone in your group has a brain.  Food youre going to need about 400,000kCal a year per person.  Possibly more if youre cold.  very doable if theres stuff lying around from civilization - i.e. its about 800 tins of beans.

QuoteIf you didnt go to the shops how long would the food last in your home?

Probably around 4 weeks.  But theres around 250 flats in the factory I live in.  Most of those people wont survive...  No problem.

What happens when most of the population dies, how are we going to prevent all the nuclear reactors etc from going critical?


Would it be a fair assumption you *may* survive the asteroid, but what about the fall of all our tech?

Even assuming people forget to turn them off, nuclear reactors turn off without maintainance.

What tech is likely to be a problem?  Almost everything it inherently built to shut down without maintainance.

Im would try to persuade SteveF that im useful enough for him to allow me to stay with him. He sounds like he has a plan!

And if that doesnt work ill board up my windows or something.

Quote from: SteveFEven assuming people forget to turn them off, nuclear reactors turn off without maintainance.

What tech is likely to be a problem?  Almost everything it inherently built to shut down without maintainance.

Would the impact of such a large asteroid likely cause earthquakes on a global scale? If that were to happen Id imagine things like gas pipes might rupture?

On the nuclear front, as we have 4 days, the sensible thing would be to shut everything down. But is 4 days long enough to remove all the fuel rods and get them into storage? And do we even have viable long term storage facilities yet? You have the WIPP in america, but generally arent things stored on site or disposed of in deep sea trenches. The on site disposal isnt long long term and so Id have thought itd be reasonable to assume that within a generation or two degradation would begin to pollute the surrounding area?

Dumping the waste at sea before the impact probably wouldnt be a good idea either if the impact was at sea?

I was thinking more of stuff like 28 days later and Manchester being on fire. Will the services really shut down all gas/electricity etc? If they do, people will need to periodically maintain things like gas cylinders. With no fire crews around fires could spread throughout the cities?

And what happens if this asteroid itself is composed of radioactive or other toxic materials that ends up vapourised and in the atmosphere? You could end up being stuck in one of these air bubbles under ground for yonks weighting for the atmosphere to become breathable maybe?

Its unlikely to cause many earthquakes after the initial shock tbh.  Theres far more power in the core of the earth than a non destructive asteroid is going to provide.

You wouldnt have to shut down the power stations.  When the power started rippling a load of boron rods would just drop into the cores and shut them down.  You wouldnt be able to start them up again but they arent going to go boom.  Im not sure why youd want to store the uranium rods - just leave them in the reactors - safest place for them and we dont exactly need them for anything.

If the gas pipes burst all that would happen is a tiny tiny tiny fraction of the worlds gas supply would go into the atmosphere instead of being in a tube.  It wouldnt really be much of a huge problem tbh.  Gas leaks into the atmosphere all the time from the ground and the oceans.


If the asteroid did hit a nuclear power plant then youd atomise a few kilos of uranium.  It would be a problem for a few miles around the nuclear plant if you stayed there for a couple of months but tbh if youre within a few miles of a nuclear plant when an asteroid hits then youre dead anyway.  Gradual radiation poisoning from a couple of grains of radioactive dust is the least of your worries.  People live in the chernobyl zone and that was before the auto shutdowns and was only really a problem because it vented radioactive gas.  the actual uranium rods didnt really make any difference.

The storage issue is from the point of view that if its not out the way, at some point its going to end up getting out of the reactors. Im thinking along the lines of the concrete sarcophagus of Chenobyl and how thats starting to degrade. The nuclear reactor is only going to last so long, but the radioactive material inside are going to remain radioactive for far longer?

Not bothered about the loss of gas from gas pipes, Im thinking more if a gas leak ignited for whatever reason? And again, the gas cylinders will need servicing or emptying, as theyll eventually corrode through etc? Small fires and explosions are likely to not take out the survivors as chances are they wouldnt be nearby. Im just trying to think of situations that could result in a fire starting without human intervention in a city. By the time survivors found it I doubt theyd be able to put it out and it could/would spread uncontrollably?

So youre faced with a meteor hitting the earth and your concern is that in 100 years+ after the event a uranium rod might start to penetrate a concrete and lead lined box?

Even if the meteor hit and at the exact same moment every nuclear reactor vanished and the uranium rods were just left on the ground in the open I dont see the problem.  Its a problem if you get within a few hundred feet of them.  Otherwise whats the prob?

But yes fire = bad.  If you stand in one you will die.  Thats kind of the same now tho and if anything theres going to be less people around.  I honestly think gas cannister corrosion isnt going to be too high up the list of problems...

Lack of fire and medical supplies - sure.  The 400 or so nuclear plants on the surface of the planet (which are kind of easy to spot) and slowly leaking gas cannisters cant be that big a deal.  Then the chances of the gas cannister having a flammable gas in them, then the combination of them leaking near an ignition source...

TBH, I think that the only people who would properly survive would be old school farmers and people in the country - and not people that have just moved to the country so they can say they moved to the country

People who grew up in towns (And I am making a sweeping generalisation here) would be f**ked because I dont know anyone that lives in a city/town that knows how to look after livestock, or grow crops, or even knows what to do with them

if it doesnt come in a packet or a bottle theyre shafted

I will also make a sweeping generalisation and say this - people that live in cities and towns are less hardy and less capable of doing without and making do than people who dont.

I know any of my friends that grew up in the city would be more concerned with the fact that they cant get a starbucks or a mcdonalds, and would be worried about getting their jeans dirty etc

Meh, what can I say? Im thinking about the long term survival of the human race rather than my own pitiful existence. The gas canister thing just comes from the amount of "training" in diving qualifications which revolve around "Pressurised cylinder...treat with care". Locally a couple of years ago someone cut into one that was still full, and it only contained air I think. He died instantly and I think a couple of other people either died/were seriously injured. Then there was the damage to property... Obviously I doubt survivors are going to be processing pressurised gas canisters anytime soon for the metal. But combining the hazard with the accelerated rate of corrosion inside and it just really takes one to fall over, crack, knock a couple others, and before you know it the BOC storage facility has gone sky high. I forget which gas it was at Uni, but I was briefed when helping to move them into the storage building about something to do with a half mile safety radius :|

I know its like splitting hairs and all that, But Im guessing theres a load of hidden hazards that none of us have thought of. Most suggestions seem to be short term how to survive the first month, and then gloss over the rest with "Band together, start building up" without considering the hazards involved in the resource collection. Feral dogs etc

Im guessing biological facilities have protocols in place for when they have advance warning of prolonged power outages? Whats in place to stop various modified viruses etc from escaping? Unless theyre all incinerated or disposed of before the power goes out, Id imagine some viruses or whatever would be able to survive for a long period of time in their containers. All itd take is a scavenger to get into the facility and break or open a phial?

The rods melted and ended up in the bottom of the reactor. With an impact from a meteor there will be rather more pushed up into the atmosphere, the whole plant will be vaporised. Most of it will land locally but the remainder will be spread around the globe, it would cause a few deaths but nothing compared to the other effects.

Gas explosions would only be a problem locally, you would have far more problems from burning debris raining on your head.

Quote from: MarkTBH, I think that the only people who would properly survive would be old school farmers and people in the country - and not people that have just moved to the country so they can say they moved to the country

People who grew up in towns (And I am making a sweeping generalisation here) would be f**ked because I dont know anyone that lives in a city/town that knows how to look after livestock, or grow crops, or even knows what to do with them

if it doesnt come in a packet or a bottle theyre shafted

I will also make a sweeping generalisation and say this - people that live in cities and towns are less hardy and less capable of doing without and making do than people who dont.

I know any of my friends that grew up in the city would be more concerned with the fact that they cant get a starbucks or a mcdonalds, and would be worried about getting their jeans dirty etc

In most cases you would be right, but there are some who know the basics of farming, and most of it isnt too brain taxing. Grain, you plough the ground and scatter the seed, wait until it ripens and then gather the produce. Most others are similar, potatoes you dig a trench and put them in the bottom, cover up, wait until the tops poke through, ramp up the soil around the plants and wait again until it dies back, then you dig up your new spuds. Most shop bought seeds have instructions on the packet.

Animals are a bit more of a problem, but not many of them are going to survive anyway.

It not so much the explosions Id be worried about as as you say, itd be rather loca. Itd be the ensuing fires if they began in a city like london. With no one around to put them out, what would happen if half of London was on fire and you were downwind from it!

TBH Zpyder I really dont think a city would be a good place to stay, regardless of whether or not it catches fire.

Even if youre the only one who survives and therefore have free run of the local Sainsburys canned food section, youre going to have more raw materials available to you out in the countryside.

For the first generation or so after impact livestock farming will not be important. Obviously its important to preserve that knowledge if anyone in your party has it, and it will come in handy if you live long enough, but the more imediately important skills will be hunting, skinning and gutting prey animals such as Rabbits.

Even canned food eventually goes off, food which is running around on 4 legs doesnt

Just thought Id chime in; there have been some pretty good "A World Without Humans" type documentaries available on Nat. Geo. and the History channel in the USA recently (funnily enough) that answer/cover a lot of the things in this thread. :)

Quote from: zpyderIt not so much the explosions Id be worried about as as you say, itd be rather loca. Itd be the ensuing fires if they began in a city like london. With no one around to put them out, what would happen if half of London was on fire and you were downwind from it!

The effects will include firing boulders to all corners of the Earth, expect large parts of London to burn anyway, same with other cities. Thats why Steves get underground advice would be so important.

A proper bunker, or reinforced cellar with an air system wouldnt be missed either, people could store stuff like their freezer in it and have some electrical generation gear. There are also machines available for recycling water, if you dont mind drinking your own urine. TBH you have probably drank water that thousands of people have drank before you anyway. It might taste a bit odd but....

As for butchering animals, they have to survive. There wont be much grass so rabbits might have problems, even if they are relatively safe from the initial effects. Rats and similar are the most likely ones to survive, then there always will be worms to eat. Roaches anyone? Yum!

If its bad enough that the rabbits dont make it, the chances of your survival beyond a few weeks are close to zero anyway. They are a good food supply precisely because they are almost impossible to eradicate completely and their populations bounce back fast. If its clear beforehand that its going to be THAT bad, getting drunk and getting laid for the remaining 4 days is your best bet.

Quote from: MongooseTBH Zpyder I really dont think a city would be a good place to stay, regardless of whether or not it catches fire.

You wouldnt have to stay in the city to be effected. The tonnes of soot from the fires would cause localised effects smothering vegetation and exposing animals to all manner of toxins. With the size of the cities in question you could be many many miles away in the countryside and still be effected. The combined soot and ash from the global fires could blanket out the atmosphere making the whole planet inhospitable?

Some info in new scientist last week suggests that 100 hiroshima sized nuclear bombs would cause the depletion of 40-70% of the ozone layer, tripling skin conditions and cancer. Im guessing a big-ass asteroid impact would be responsible for a bit more damage to such things, and youd probably want to be underground for longer than a couple of years in this case?

This thread is making me think of a book called "Children of the dust"

crikey.... youve been arguing now for 4 days. suppose your all dead  :w00t:

Quote from: Eggtasticocrikey.... youve been arguing now for 4 days. suppose your all dead  :w00t:

Damn! I KNEW we should have got the beer in when we had the chance!

Try to get to SteveF all the problems that will arise seem to get solved without much of a problem what with the nuclear power plants shuting down by themselfs and that working out okay and water from the sea, and 800 tins of baked beans lying around, all sounds like something Homer simpson would spurt out.....  :w00t:

(http://z.about.com/d/animatedtv/1/0/D/U/simpTHOH_Survival_v5_72.jpg)

As a different idea...would anyone consider suicide?

Quote from: FaT LeoNTry to get to SteveF all the problems that will arise seem to get solved without much of a problem what with the nuclear power plants shuting down by themselfs and that working out okay and water from the sea, and 800 tins of baked beans lying around, all sounds like something Homer simpson would spurt out.....  :w00t:

mmm, a society based on Tekforums members. Its not clear to me that would be a good idea.

youve all totaly missed the point....

whats the point in surviving if theres no hot girls left to survive with ?

Quote from: knightyyouve all totaly missed the point....

whats the point in surviving if theres no hot girls left to survive with ?

Who do you think we are going to kidnap and take down our holes with us? :P

They have taken the bridge, and the second hall. We have barred the gates, but cannot hold them for long. The ground shakes. Drums, drums in the deep. We cannot get out. A shadow moves in the dark. We cannot get out. They are coming for knighty and the last remaining pack of generic viagra.

And so the final battle between the derranged remenants of society is fought in SteveFs cave.

There not getting their hands on MY fing viagra, pass the shotgun...   :yarr:  :tinhat:

/knighty hides in the corner then closes his eyes hopeing serisous doesnt find him and that his arse will stop hurting soon :s

Quote from: sdpThey have taken the bridge, and the second hall. We have barred the gates, but cannot hold them for long. The ground shakes. Drums, drums in the deep. We cannot get out. A shadow moves in the dark. We cannot get out. They are coming for knighty and the last remaining pack of generic viagra.

And so the final battle between the derranged remenants of society is fought in SteveFs cave.

 :rofl:

If they need viagra then they shouldnt be allowed to live