OTOH what you two did was very predictable. Mongoose assumed I was saying something which I obviously wasnt and SteveF puts both feet in after reading that
Of course were predictable and you are too
What youre not seeing is youve still not got it right. I only spend the time on this because you seem like a bright lad but you constantly miss the point. You believe that when someone says string theory is proven false and brane-theory is now accepted (for example) somehow means that scientists got everything wrong. This isnt whats happening. Humanity is trying to work out whwat happens at the edges of what humans can experience so we can build faster electronics, teleportation, whatever. These theories are constantly being revised but they only apply at the sub atomic level. Changing them doesnt change the rest of the universe models. All of the other rules/laws stay the same.
Its a fundamental mistake youre making in every thread and you dont see the mistake.
Mongoose and Funky Chicken are totally right on the laws of physics. they really dont change. People on this forum (well Serious at least) go on as if the whole system radically changes every couple of years when it really doesnt. Quantum physics didnt change how balls roll around. When string theory appeared it didnt change quantum effects or balls rolling round. When the next insight appears it still wont change how balls roll around. The laws of thermodynamics and macroscopic objects are proven - the only things that have changed is people have found that the same rules dont apply to tiny or massive objects, or when travelling at incredibly high speed. The day to day rules dont change and havent in any noticeable way since Newton and co wrote them down.
Did I say that? Please point me to where. I do acknowledge its possible that they do change, and several theories have speculated this.
You said it at the very top of your post and youre even saying it at the end of the question youre asking lol.
I have said the theories change, not that what the universe does changes,
I do acknowledge its possible that they do change
No. This is the bit you get wrong in each conversation about science. We both agree that the universe underneath doesnt chage (lets ignore the fringe stuff for the sake of simplicity because if the universe is changing as it expands then the change is so slight at this point in the universes lifecycle that we cant even detect it.
The part we disagree on is have the laws of every day objects changed. Ill give you that quantum physics changed and string thery, M-theory and wave function theories are all changing but they only exist at the sub atomic level. Those
theories do not change or even modify the laws at the normal/human/macroscopic level. These laws of thermodynamics and mechanics are known and unchanging.
It doesnt matter how many new insights we have at the sub sub atomic level or dimensional level to explain how the components of matter exist - the laws of thermodynamics stay the same and always have. The laws governing everything from atoms up to solar systems are fixed and the other theories at the subatomic level do not affect them in any meaningful way. Conversely, the sub atomic theories have to match the known macroscopic laws to be considered valid as a complete theory.
The only things on our day to day experience that would effect a perpetual motion machine would be energy/waves, matter and thermodynamics
a) the removal of the concept of the ether. This was simply because people didnt understand the nature of waves. People now know exactly what a wave is - we can see them and interact with them and harness them. Waves exist, follow set rules and the laws wont change.
b) the discovery of the atom. All the sub atomic particles have little to no impact on the macroscopic level as atoms are as small as you need to go. Theres a question of how matter works but we know what it is and how to interact with and control it. Matter follows set rules and the laws wont change.
c) conservation of energy is the core of thermodynamics. These laws have been proven mathematically, through experimentation, through modelling and are in fact the only law that seems to work not only on the macroscopic level but also scales down to the subatomic levels as well. The laws of energy transfer (i.e. energy cannot be created or destroyed, merely changed from one kind to another) are fixed, well known and will not change.
Anything that you build on earth that is bigger than an atom and isnt travelling at the speed of light with mass is going to obey these rules. Granted, it is possible that the conservation of energy doesnt hold at black holes or wormholes where extreme gravity and time distortions could do something funky but that doesnt happen under normal levels (and may not occur at black holes either, who knows
).
It is possible that you could accelerate mass beyond the speed of light and then slow it down to the speed of light (so it has infinite mass) and use the momentum to drive something which would be an expolit of particle mass but you cant get mass up anywhere close to the speed of light under normal (or possibly any) circumstances anyway. If you can then its going to require some very extreme conditions.
It is also possible that waves dont behave as waves all the time as theres a strong indication they didnt moments after the big bang. But a few moments after the big bang till now theyve stayed the same (within any noticeable way).
The macroscopic laws are known and wont change. Its the fringes of science that are changing all the time. Those changes do not in any way change the known laws. I think this may simply be a misunderstanding on your part.
Physics is an attempt to model how the balls run around, to describe how things work. The problem is they may end up with a theory which, while it describes everything in perfect detail, is totally wrong.
This is a silly statement. Physics hasnt been this for a long time. The movement of the balls is known. Theres no physics element of it anymore. Thats mechanics. Its a law and proven in so many ways that its not even an issue. If you dont see why the above is true then i dont think I can explain it any better - Im stumped. Guess its easier for you to just believe every revision of one of the quantum theories rewrites all human knowledge and the balls moving on the table need further study.
You wont find a single law of physics that has been disproved or modified. These things only become law when theyve been proven. Science has very few things it can prove but it has proven these. The title "law" is kept for a very specific set of rules. Theyre the ones that are known to be correct.
