omg!
very good read imo (http://www.ubuntuattack.info/)
spread the hate!
And why would I want to go and do a thing like that.
Come on you Vista :D
Cheers
Tongy
Ubuntu is awesome.
If you dont care that fonts render like sh*t.
Nah Im good with XP thanks works fine for me! :D
Quote from: SamUbuntu is awesome.
Fonts render just as good, if not better than in Windows XP.
Fixed. :mrgreen:
Ya, the fonts are spectacular, and you have all sorts of fine grained ways to tweak the rendering that XP doesnt give ya.
Some fonts:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/46/114297120_1999f30b5e_o.jpg
Theyre not fixed skidzilla. They still look shocking. I spent an entire weekend once with those patches youve linked to and other things. Basically when I say fonts, I mean the entire GUI. The spaces between menu items is too big. The widgets just have too much padding.
I love linux but the GUI is truly awful.
Quote from: maximusotterYa, the fonts are spectacular, and you have all sorts of fine grained ways to tweak the rendering that XP doesnt give ya.
Some fonts:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/46/114297120_1999f30b5e_o.jpg
I mean look at that. Can anyone actually work on a system that is so bad ? I suppose its ok if you browse the web for an hour a day and listen to mp3s but my computer is my income and I cannot work on something so ugly.
Quote from: SamTheyre not fixed skidzilla. They still look shocking. I spent an entire weekend once with those patches youve linked to and other things. Basically when I say fonts, I mean the entire GUI. The spaces between menu items is too big. The widgets just have too much padding.
I love linux but the GUI is truly awful.
Now youre just making sh*t up, as you got caught with your pants down about the fonts--which have been spectacular for five years.
"The spaces between menu items is too big". Oh come ON--youre a funny guy! "The widgets have too much padding". Which widgets? GTK, QT, TK? Which ones? Give us an example.
As it is, youre just spreading FUD as youre too chicken to admit you were wrong about the fonts.
Quote from: SamQuote from: maximusotterYa, the fonts are spectacular, and you have all sorts of fine grained ways to tweak the rendering that XP doesnt give ya.
Some fonts:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/46/114297120_1999f30b5e_o.jpg
I mean look at that. Can anyone actually work on a system that is so bad ? I suppose its ok if you browse the web for an hour a day and listen to mp3s but my computer is my income and I cannot work on something so ugly.
Grasping at straws, you is.
Whats ugly about it? The colors? Then f**king change it. Stop acting like a defensive three year old caught in a lie. Those are my choices of neutral colors that are comfy for hours and hours of screen time.
And the alternative default is primary playskool colors? :rofl:
i think sam should abandon computer work totally, he sounds more like a gay hairdresser so far in this thread... :shock:
Quote from: maximusotterNow youre just making sh*t up, as you got caught with your pants down about the fonts--which have been spectacular for five years.
Did I bollocks.
Quote"The spaces between menu items is too big". Oh come ON--youre a funny guy! "The widgets have too much padding". Which widgets? GTK, QT, TK? Which ones? Give us an example.
As it is, youre just spreading FUD as youre too chicken to admit you were wrong about the fonts.
Its ugly. There are 10,000 threads about it on forums around the world.
This is eclipse on gnome
http://klomp.org/mark/classpath/eclipse-gnome-gij.png
This is eclipse on XP
http://tmap.pmel.noaa.gov/~rhs/ebug/j2ee4.jpg
http://www.devbiz.com/teamplain/eclipse/images/screens/workitemeditor-win.gif
On the left hand side package explorer, you can get far more listings in XP. Thats just one example of how excess space leads to lack of productivity. Look at the menus on the gnome version - 12 pixels of white space between each one. Look at the ugly huge arrow instead of a
- when using a file explorer. Ugly.
Now I appreciate most people use the computer to browse porn and post sh*t on a forum, but I use mine to develop software and little things like this make linux less productive.
Ive tried many times to get a GUI configured how I like it but linux just looks ugly.
Sam has a point. Ive noticed that Linux likes to "oversize things", and yup its mildly annoying for me, when im just someone who uses programming ides for uni project work or faffing around, if I was using it on a daily basis... it would become a deciding factor im sure.
Quote from: M3ta7h3adSam has a point. Ive noticed that Linux likes to "oversize things"
Linux is a non-gui kernel. Till you guys can actually make a valid argument about a specific tool kit, Ill continue to point and :rofl: at yall.
Your arguing semantics. When a man has been reduced to semantics then he knows his argument has been lost.
Linux in that context means "linux distributions" i.e. kernel + gui/toolkit.
Im not arguing semantics.
Linux is a non gui-kernel. You cant complain about its visuals, as it has zero.
There are a half dozen commonly used tool kits used for gui construction upon this kernel. If you or Sam have issues with them, then show screenshots and examples. As is, youre both full of it. :lol:
I like Linux for general usage and web development work, but i have to admit it does take some time to customise. I guess if you dont have the time to spend learning Linux itself then you are better off sticking with Windows.
I would say that for a general business then Windows wins down to the fact everyone who uses a PC can sit down and use windows. One of my customers has Solaris and Suse all over the place due to specialist engineering software he has. Ive had to write a fairly extensive quickstart manual for people who arent *NIX users (almost everyone), and they complain for weeks until they get used to it.
the only windows boxen in the place are the Salemens Laptops, and that is because they came with XP Home on them already, and they dont need to use the special software.
Quote from: maximusotterIm not arguing semantics.
Linux is a non gui-kernel. You cant complain about its visuals, as it has zero.
There are a half dozen commonly used tool kits used for gui construction upon this kernel. If you or Sam have issues with them, then show screenshots and examples. As is, youre both full of it. :lol:
I wasnt considering linux as a non-gui kernel, as I explained in my last post, I considered linux as describing "linux distributions". I.E. the linux kernel, and whatever default toolkit/wm they come with.
The 2 major players of Gnome and KDE all suffer the same issues of excessive whitespace, and large fonts. - Great for a gran, not so good for someone trying to be as efficient as possible.
Sams supplied screenshots that adequately explain what I mean.
The only linux type OS I got on with was Lindows, shame they binned it really.
Quote from: M3ta7h3adThe 2 major players of Gnome and KDE all suffer the same issues of excessive whitespace, and large fonts. - Great for a gran, not so good for someone trying to be as efficient as possible.
change it if you dont like it, thats the joy of an opensource gui, you can custumise everything in a few short clicks.
Quote from: maximusotterQuote from: M3ta7h3adSam has a point. Ive noticed that Linux likes to "oversize things"
Linux is a non-gui kernel. Till you guys can actually make a valid argument about a specific tool kit, Ill continue to point and :rofl: at yall.
I made a valid point. And I proved you wrong.
You then came back and said Linux was a non Gui OS which is nonsense, since all GUIs are layers on an OS even if in windows its tightly integrated or non customizable. And that was a tacit admission I was right.
Let me say for the final time just so max can understand.
I like Linux, I prefer Linux for its power. I admin 10 servers each running at least 40 web sites and theyre all on Redhat. I program in Java which is far easier to work with on Linux. However Linuxs Gui is shocking. Until that is sorted out it will never be a replacement for XP for development. The majority of users of Netbeans and Eclipse also use XP (and those account for nearly all use of an IDE in Java space).
Unfortunately in the world of Linux, linux fan boys like Max never take criticism. The stock answer is always "you dont know what youre doing". Aside from the point Ive forgotten more about computers than most people know, a user shouldnt have to be a programmer to get a working system - and Im talking in general here not just the ugliness of KDE and Gnome.
Quote from: Sama user shouldnt have to be a programmer to get a working system
exactly the point I once argued where i was working. One of the permanent IT staff was complaining that users where stupid because they couldnt install and configure the network printer from the repositories.
Edit: I would also like to point out that the hardware support on many Linux distros is also shocking. Just got another lappy here that ive tried to slide Ubuntu on, and it appears to be tripping up on the Chipset. Its an ATI chipset that is supposedly supported, when in fact its not. Its Getting openSUSE instead, i know that works with this chipset because I use it on my own.
Try that same Laptop with FreeBSD and you will be pleasantly surprised :)
I always avoided FreeBSD because of its rubbish port of Java. Now that Java is opensource that might change.
Quote from: MarkTry that same Laptop with FreeBSD and you will be pleasantly surprised :)
Cant, the software hell be using on it aparrently lists Ubuntu, SUSE and RedHat as supported OSen, so im sticking with the recommended, its far far easier.
If its out for linux, is more than likely in ports.
Linux binary compatibility is an install option..
Quote from: MarkIf its out for linux, is more than likely in ports.
Linux binary compatibility is an install option..
and since the job is already done, and im getting paid tonight for it im not installing it all over again ;)
i certainly prefer the windows look to the linux look if im honest, windows looks more professional IMO
Quote from: redomg!
very good read imo
spread the hate!
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Go Ubuntu!!!
lol just tried to put ubuntu onto a work PC - didnt even install.
Its now happily running XP SP2...... go figure...
Quote from: Binary Shadowi certainly prefer the windows look to the linux look if im honest, windows looks more professional IMO
really? Ive always thought XP out of the box looks like a kids cartoon