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Chat => Entertainment & Technology => Topic started by: weazel on January 28, 2008, 17:18:41 PM

Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 28, 2008, 17:18:41 PM
found this http://datasheet.eeworld.com.cn/part/183472_SIGE_SE2521A60.html

giving u lots o nice graphs telling u how much gain u can get
coupled with a sink could be prity good

oh and this http://www.zero13wireless.net/foro/showthread.php?t=1236
how to attach a ariel/pigtail what ever u wanna call it .. might have to reg to view

hopefully get a few more dbi
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 09:51:04 AM
checked the SE2521A60 after about a hour of use and its not even warm,
so i recon its safe to say there not pumping alot of volts into it already
and as belkin is usless at giving dbm rating on there products im having to work of
adverages .. checked specs on 13 other usb adapters i could get specs on and they adaverage
between 13 - 17 dbm in G mode so im guessing the belkin might be around 15-16 ish

ill get a multi meter on it later to find out proper v

oh using it without its plastic casing gives an extra 2dbi in netstumbler
just shows how the simplest of things can knock ur signal down
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 17:26:01 PM

checked the voltage its at 3.3v .. so can easy put another 0.7v into it
just not sure of the best spot to or method to do it?

pull directly of the usb, drop resistor zenner maybe?

anyone got any sugestions?
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 29, 2008, 17:30:58 PM
I wont make suggestions because i dont want to be party to your breaking your stuff! Sorry.
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 17:36:16 PM
i have 2 belkins .. got one to test performance diffrence against the modded one

just need the best way to get 4v directly of the usb cos it gonna be a nightmare
soldering to any other parts
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 29, 2008, 17:57:25 PM
Quote from: weazeli have 2 belkins .. got one to test performance diffrence against the modded one

just need the best way to get 4v directly of the usb cos it gonna be a nightmare
soldering to any other parts

well, usb is +5V, isnt it? rather easy to work out a potential divider circuit to give you the required voltage.
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 18:27:48 PM
yeah its 5v .. just thought i could use 2 rectifiers in serial should give me 1v drop but
supplying half wave to the SE2521A60 might cause problems?

well not half wave but pulsed
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 29, 2008, 19:37:57 PM
Quote from: weazelyeah its 5v .. just thought i could use 2 rectifiers in serial should give me 1v drop but
supplying half wave to the SE2521A60 might cause problems?

well not half wave but pulsed

google for potential divider

[edit:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltage_divider

look at the first pic. Z2 needs to be 4 times greater than Z1 to provide 4V Vout. Z2 and Z1 need to be big enough to not draw too much current, but not so big to limit the current to whatever mod it is that youre doing. Easy enough to work out.]
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: soopahfly on January 29, 2008, 19:51:14 PM
Just what is it your trying to do?!?
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 20:00:14 PM
nice one cheers...... forgot about that

shouldnt have any problems now... well only 1 maybe, read up that usb port can only supply up to 500ma.. hopefully thats just for laptops cos i dont know how much the belkins draw it says max 500ma on the box, hope not or im gonna have to find a adapter
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 20:02:04 PM
Quote from: soopahflyJust what is it your trying to do?!?

ram some more power into the front end amp of a wifi usb adapter to get more dbm

and also to see if its possible
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: M3ta7h3ad on January 29, 2008, 20:16:53 PM
usb will only supply 500ma... and thats not just for laptops.

Why are you using rectifiers on a USB output? I thought it was 5VDC?
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 20:23:00 PM
Quote from: M3ta7h3adusb will only supply 500ma... and thats not just for laptops.

Why are you using rectifiers on a USB output? I thought it was 5VDC?

u sure .. nightamre .. ill have to start with real low ma then

was gonna use it for dropping the v to 4v cos thats the recomended max v for the se2521a60

but Maldonado idea is better and less chance of interferance ..

trying to find suitable resistors now
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 29, 2008, 20:41:45 PM
Im not responsible if you break anything. Dont take this the wrong way, but if you didnt know about potential dividers before you started this little exercise, then you need to question whether or not its prudent to go through with it. Are you actually having trouble with your wireless dropping out?
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 21:06:41 PM
Quote from: MaldonadoIm not responsible if you break anything. Dont take this the wrong way, but if you didnt know about potential dividers before you started this little exercise, then you need to question whether or not its prudent to go through with it. Are you actually having trouble with your wireless dropping out?

no offence taken .. lol.. i woud have probably used a zener and a resistor or rectifiers and a resistor .. but ur method is alot better ..... i know im probably gonna blow this up 1st try but i have one spare so i can still connect no matter what happens ... i have a bit of a bad connection but it works fine most of the time and it does me fine, currently using quite a large horn atm which gives me a 16-17dbi boost

but this is just another experement , want to mess about with long range links at some point figure the harware is more the place to start .. i mean u can always make bigger antennas easy
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: M3ta7h3ad on January 29, 2008, 21:29:59 PM
Rectifiers drop voltage? I thought with a DC current it would effectively be a short circuit.

If all you are doing is dropping 1v, just shove a single resistor in series. 1v is an incredibly small amount to drop at low current like 0.5A

what... 1/0.5 = 2Ohms... you need a 2 Ohm resistor... its hardly worth even bothering with a voltage divider.

Zener Diodes... again... how would you go about causing a volt drop like that? Last time I used them was in a feedback circuit to set off a "clipping" LED on a power amp, as current flows as it approached breakdown voltage (i.e. filtering out low voltages/signals in order to only allow high through) I dont see how youd do it with either a rectifier or a zener diode, and certainly not a plain ol diode. Be interesting if you could post it up like as I could always be mistaken.

What im worried about is not blowing up the adapter, but instead you burning out your usb ports :D

Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: M3ta7h3ad on January 29, 2008, 21:33:44 PM
Ahhh just did some googling.

Youre doing a shunt voltage regulator, if its a zener diode :) I see! :D Nice... but somewhat over complex for what you need surely.
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 21:46:14 PM
Quote from: M3ta7h3adAhhh just did some googling.

Youre doing a shunt voltage regulator, if its a zener diode :) I see! :D Nice... but somewhat over complex for what you need surely.

yeah ...it was but forgot loads of stuff, was one of the only things i could remeber with reg voltage

gonna try feeding about 20ma to start see what it does .. mainly cos it the only resistor combo i can do atm

currently stripping a broke multi meter for resistors atm .. got most of what i need
might be able to test this tonight
QuoteWhat im worried about is not blowing up the adapter, but instead you burning out your usb ports

already shorted it a few times when i was testing the voltage of the feed .. just turned the adapter of and back on started connecting again stright away .. so hopefully i wont pop out
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 29, 2008, 22:57:41 PM
woohoo .. done 1st test .. and it didnt pop it

got 3.8v from dropping v with resistors, should have fed about 16ma or less

gained about 1 -2dbi in net stumbler ....

gonna go to maplin tomorrow to get more resistors so i can crank it up

(http://photos-d.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/s533785797_321799_8301.jpg)
(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sctm/v183/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323273_15.jpg)
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 30, 2008, 11:23:58 AM
Lol, congrats i suppose!
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 12:18:44 PM
cheers done 2nd test dropped 10 ohm got 4v now but dbi is even worst than it was unmodded .. might have hit the point where the usb cant feed any more power ... ether that or i re-wired it wrong .. .gonna find a power pack and try that
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 30, 2008, 12:23:10 PM
Windows will pop up a message if you a drawing too much power. Youll probably find a sweet spot where you apply a particular voltage and it gives you the best results. Drop it a little and see what it does.
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 12:26:33 PM
QuoteWindows will pop up a message if you a drawing too much power
..

oh didnt know that .. it hasnt done that yet so cant be that .. thinking about it i didnt add any ohms to the r2 when i dropped 10ohm of r1 .. might be the cause.. gonna add some to r2 now
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 30, 2008, 12:35:06 PM
Take a trip to Maplins and buy a variable resistor IMO.
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 12:48:01 PM
QuoteTake a trip to Maplins and buy a variable resistor IMO.

already been to maplins once today to lazy to walk back

added 100 ohm to r2 and its dropped even more

(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323363_7498.jpg)

think ive re-wired it wrong .. it must be sucking power out of the amp instead of putting it in

or there is some other factor i havent figured out yet?
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 30, 2008, 12:49:36 PM
Go back to maplins and buy a variable resistor or two. Get a 1kohm and a 10kohm. Should only cost pennies. Connect the middle pin to where you want to apply the voltage. If it still drops off, use a larger resistor.
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 13:14:08 PM
just double checked ive re-wired it backwards .. was tapping power of the amp
so the 1-2dbi increase the 1st time might have been from the 2nd ariel when i removed the rf shielding cos that doesnt apear to be attached anywhere..

so now is a real test if im gonna pop it ..
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 13:40:34 PM
woohoo holy **** it atually worked

1st scan is unmodded
2nd scan is without rf shielding which 2nd antenna was behind i think
3rd scan finally re-wired properly at 4.14v but probably less once its drawing power
cant check volts while in operation cos ill short it out, stuff in the way. it barley got warm so recon im gonna try pumping more into it  
(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323393_2200.jpg)
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 16:29:55 PM
bumped the voltage up more .. dont even know what its at now .. seams that the more i pump in its only helping distance now and its atually impeading close range stuff this network is the furthest way .. oh i also picked up 2 networks ive never seen before, so it must be doing something

1st scan in unmodded version 2nd modded
(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323476_3441.jpg)

this network is bit closer than the last
(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323477_3748.jpg)

this is the closest network to me .. signal has atually dropped .. ? dont understand it myself
(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323478_3946.jpg)

something must be limiting the poweroutput now just dunno what it is, might have sensors to stop it pulling more power of the usb so it doesnt damage it and its compensating for the mod ? must have about 4.5v into it now and recomeneded max was 4v .. havent burnt anything out cos it operates fine?
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 30, 2008, 17:53:35 PM
lol, nice one, keep up the good work :D
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 18:39:41 PM
cheers .. there has to be something limiting power cos it should have tryed to fry by now .. only thing i can think of is disabling the power sensing section if i can, might be dropping the controled curent to compensate with the mod .. gonna have to read up more  

maybe i could alter that instead and trick it into feeding more v

i mean if it fryed from over voltage id know id be on the right track
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 30, 2008, 19:00:27 PM
Use a different USB header to provide your extra voltage
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 19:12:19 PM
i dont think thats gonna make a diffrence im pulling direct of the socket atm ...just been reading this

http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6603350-description.html

recon im gonna have to trick the power detector, its detecting slap bang in the middle of the amp

(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323548_7543.jpg)
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 19:30:23 PM
looking at this if im reading it right? i basicly stick a real high resistor before the sensor so it doesnt pick anything up?

just realised unfortinuatly thats all embeded .. gonna have to figure out the feedback circit ........grrrrrrrr

(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sctm/v183/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323552_3309.jpg)
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 30, 2008, 22:57:56 PM
(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sctm/v183/47/87/533785797/n533785797_323723_1798.jpg)
from what i can gather adding more v to the output should have done it. tryed that didnt do squat ..

so well stuck now anyone got any ideas?
Title: volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Maldonado on January 30, 2008, 23:13:35 PM
I stand by my previous posts.
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: lac on January 31, 2008, 02:39:48 AM
f u can figure out the feedback circuit and find out the value of the feedback resistor you might be able to increase the gain of the final stage.
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: Serious on January 31, 2008, 02:57:32 AM
If hes really good hell stick a pan on top and cook some eggs and sausage when hes finished ;)
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 31, 2008, 09:10:01 AM
Quote from: lacf u can figure out the feedback circuit and find out the value of the feedback resistor you might be able to increase the gain of the final stage.

there is a 0.5 ohm resistor after the pd out ive stuck 0.4v before it and that didnt do anything

Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 31, 2008, 10:02:30 AM
it must be feeding back to the bcm2050 at some point but i cant find a data sheet on it .. so well stuck on manipulating the feedback atm

(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sctm/v183/47/87/533785797/n533785797_324165_1780.jpg)
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on January 31, 2008, 12:59:11 PM
QuoteThe BCM2050 is only capable of 5 dBm

of this forum
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11569610

and the only thing i can come up with now is this

(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/n533785797_324200_8406.jpg)


the SE2521A60 has a max recomened input of 2dbm tho .. so cant really up the power much that way . and as i cant find pin data on the bcm2050 i think this is a dead end now .. grr nightamre . only way to get data sheet is from broadcom themselfs and i dont thik there gonna give it to me, it seams to be well hush hush stuff no site has any data sheets on it

(http://photos-797.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v192/47/87/533785797/n533785797_324201_8587.jpg)
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: lac on February 02, 2008, 00:17:07 AM
check for feedback resistor at pin 18 and 21 going to pin 6, if their is a resistor their, try to increase its value to 2x to 10x, if its not working or their is none their, then the gain must be fixed and embeded.you can also try making ur own feedback its worth a try.
Title: Re:volt modding USB BELKIN F5D7051 ?
Post by: weazel on February 02, 2008, 09:12:15 AM
Quote from: laccheck for feedback resistor at pin 18 and 21 going to pin 6, if their is a resistor their, try to increase its value to 2x to 10x, if its not working or their is none their, then the gain must be fixed and embeded.you can also try making ur own feedback its worth a try.

ant_B at pin 18 isnt even connected to anything .. ant_A at pin 21  has a resistor inline with it and thats about it, not sure its working the feedback from there, the gain shoudnt be fixed because thats what the power dectector is for to throtle the power ... although changing the power to 25% from 100% in setting seams to make no difrence .. so might be fixed .. or there is a voltage comparitor its using somewhere to fix the voltage .. but without having all the data sheets im never gonna know ..... think its a dead end now .. well on this usb anyhow

but i did find this http://www.solwise.co.uk/wireless-indoor-wl-ipa2.4-booster.htm
they also sell amps up to 4watt but i wount go that far


also found this about homemade amps
http://www.zero13wireless.net/foro/showthread.php?t=254