Quote from: M3ta7h3adEr... are the FZ-20 or FZ-30 dSLRs?? Thought they were "prosumer" cameras just like your current one.

The FZ-20, "prosumer" as you put it, is my current one and in quite some areas outperforms a DSLR, as does yours. I was just backing you up.

QuoteAn E500 is a dSLR. It has all the bells and whistles of the canon, plus the ultrasonic dust thing, and its cheaper, comes with more fittings.

There is also personal preference and quality to deal with. Dust is a right pain if it gets on the sensor a DSLR though. So far the only reccommendation is to change the lens holding it lens down, this does seem to work.

QuoteMy point I was making with the zoom comparison is that Brummie owns a S5600... hes used to 10x zoom (300 and something mm), when he has a dSLR the first thing hell end up buying for a canon is another zoom lens so it gives him more reach.

The only real advantages are as I said, low light and combined with action. I had the same choice when I got the FZ-20 and decided to save the money. So far I havent been disappointed as in order to match it I would have to have spent several grand on lenses. There is a review of the FZ-30 being put up against a Canon eos-20D with this sort of lens assortment and there really wasnt much advantage for the Canon dispite the extra cost.

http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/panasonic_lumix_dmc-fz30_canon_eos-20d_camera_shootout/

QuoteThe Oly comes with one, it also comes with a lower zoom lens, and they both compliment each other, so he wont be stuck with dead ground in between the two lenses where hed need to buy another lens.

Peronally I wouldnt consider the 38-55 canon zoom, I would go for a 28-105 to go with the 90-200. This would provide an overlap with the shorter lens providing portrait use. An alternative make 80-300 zoom coupled with a 2x teleconverter should give acceptable performance up to 600mm

I agree with the other points.

But just to clarify:

QuotePeronally I wouldnt consider the 38-55 canon zoom

Aye... but you dont have a choice its the lens the canon comes with. not sure if it is a 55... but I know there is a distinct gap between my mates two lenses

Quote from: M3ta7h3adI agree with the other points.

But just to clarify:

QuotePeronally I wouldnt consider the 38-55 canon zoom

Aye... but you dont have a choice its the lens the canon comes with. not sure if it is a 55... but I know there is a distinct gap between my mates two lenses

if you go into a decent camera shop you should at least be able to buy it body only, if not bundled with some decent glassware. The 18-55 which comes with the Canon is not very good. A friend of my Dads has a 350D which he got with a twin lens Tamron kit which apparently (I havnt seen it) knocks spots off the standard Canon glass. That of course isnt too hard, if you look on Steves digicams the comparison shots clearly show both the Nikon and Pentax 18-55 zooms as far superior to the Canon. Frankly my Lumix FX-7 compact has better glass than comes with the 350D.

There used to be a couple of companies that did special deals with the camera body and a couple of non-standard lenses like that, it ended up slightly cheaper than getting the standard lens as well as the other two. I have no idea if they are still going :/.

See things like that put me off.

Im in no rush TBH. Think the prices of both might come down a bit more?

might drop a bit after the summer "I need a new camera for my holiday" rush I suppose. Dont know that much about the Oly, but the Canon has been out for a while so I doubt it will drop much further, unless as a response to one of the other big names dropping their prices.

Quote from: Mongoosemight drop a bit after the summer "I need a new camera for my holiday" rush I suppose. Dont know that much about the Oly, but the Canon has been out for a while so I doubt it will drop much further, unless as a response to one of the other big names dropping their prices.

damn

can yous with the 350d send us a well lit daylight and an indoors shot?
Mail it us or somat? Raw would be better but jpeg if you have to.

The oly will probably drop with the new 330 thats been released with LCD Live preview (Yay!!! no need to constantly look through the viewfinder to compose a shot! )

Quote from: M3ta7h3adThe oly will probably drop with the new 330 thats been released with LCD Live preview (Yay!!! no need to constantly look through the viewfinder to compose a shot! )

Dont use that feaure on my 5600 very often and would probably only miss it very occiasionally. Still i will have my 5600 if i need that feature

Liveview, or, oh dear weve just realised our viewfinder is the worst in the industry and our 2x crop factor means theres nothing we can do about it

Something like this sigma lens package might be better, remember that a 35mm film frame is still 1.6 times the chip on the 350D IIRC so the actual magnification will be larger giving 28-80mm on the 18-50mm. The lenses are certainly cheaper than genuine Canon ones although they may not be as perfect I doubt if the average user would note the difference.

http://www.pixmania.co.uk/uk/uk/128670/art/canon/eos-eos-350d-18-50mm-f3-5.html

OTOH if you dont mind refurbished stock and going through e-bay then have a look at the Canon outlet there

Quote from: MongooseLiveview, or, oh dear weve just realised our viewfinder is the worst in the industry and our 2x crop factor means theres nothing we can do about it

I use the screen 9 times out of 10 on my Panasonic simply because the synthetic viewfinder isnt up to much, then again most superzooms have the same problem. What it does gain you is the ability to use your camera when its held above your head or close to the ground without having to lie down or get a pair of stilts/ladder.

I will use the viewfinder but only if there is a reflection problem caused by strong sunlight.

Quote from: Serious

Quote from: MongooseLiveview, or, oh dear weve just realised our viewfinder is the worst in the industry and our 2x crop factor means theres nothing we can do about it

I use the screen 9 times out of 10 on my Panasonic simply because the synthetic viewfinder isnt up to much, then again most superzooms have the same problem. What it does gain you is the ability to use your camera when its held above your head or close to the ground without having to lie down or get a pair of stilts/ladder.

I will use the viewfinder but only if there is a reflection problem caused by strong sunlight.

Indeed, my point was that on a full on SLR I would expect the viewfinder to beat the pants off anything an EVF or LCD can manage. The only DSLR I have looked through which comes close to what I expect is the Pentax *ist and frankly even my DL2s viewfinder is small compared to my ME-F. The DL2 is at least bright, the Nikon D50 has a truely pathetic finder, but when you start to look at a system with a 2x crop factor there is no way you can build a decent size viewfinder without hitting something in the region of 1.5x magnification, which is going to make that finder very very dark. Whichever way you slice it, the Canon has to have a better viewfinder than the Oly, and Oly can only compete by adding the ability to use the screen as a viewfinder. This is no real substitute because of the inevitable time lag involved. If you want true SLR performance, you have to have a true through the lens SLR viewfinder. That is after all the defining feature of an SLR right?

Ive been looking at DSLR a bit latly as im very tempted to up grade the FZ30 I got in dec, for me, of those two, the Cannon is the one I would go for due to following

sensor size:
Cannons 22 mm x 15 mm Vs Olys 18 x 13.5 mm
the 4/3 spec meens the sensor will stay small where the canneons an go to the full 35mm frame admitedly only EF lenses though,

Crop facter:

Cannon 1.6x vs Olys 2x
Its easy to get highter telephoto but your wide angle is expensive with out fisheyeing

Start up time: (to me one of the most inportant)
Due to the sonic sensor cleaning the oly lumers at start up ,at about 3 secs , meens you have to leave it on to be ready when you want it . but the 350 is ready in about 0.25 sec

Just read a head to head review of the E-330 against 350D in diital Camera Buyer and they came down ever so slightly in favour of the Olympus but also saying the Canon gives better VFM. Also dont forget that Panasonic should be bringing their version of the Olympus out later this year

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0602/06022609panasonicdmcl1.asp

http://www.panasonic.co.uk/news/pukweb04-dyn-news-onthemove-l1-development.html

Quote from: Alien8Start up time: (to me one of the most inportant)
Due to the sonic sensor cleaning the oly lumers at start up ,at about 3 secs , meens you have to leave it on to be ready when you want it . but the 350 is ready in about 0.25 sec

1.7 seconds for the olympus according to DCB. While you might not think it dust on the image sensor which can be expensive to remove.

My choice would probably still go with the Canon though for night work

[edit]

Quote from: Alien8Ive been looking at DSLR a bit latly as im very tempted to up grade the FZ30 I got in dec,

Canon is going to cover all the bases with its own superzoom on the principle of if you cant beat em, join em Spec may look remarkably similar to the Lumix range...

clicky