as a side note (because im too drunk to do a proper post)

I knew a guy at 6th form who wanted to do media studies.... but after a TV guy came in and talked to him he did physics at uni instead..... the guy told him no-one in any kind of media did media studies at uni....

(iirc he got 5 x As at Alvls so wasnt aiming low!)

Quote from: Eggtasticobut you are going from one extreme to another.
I meant how many people waste time with uni, etc. & end up in careers where  the wages aint as good as a skilled labourers Job?

comparing two extremes tbh...

at the extreme end of the scale there are a top few plumbers who can earn 90k - i.e. what an average accountant can get fairly easily after a few years but if you compare with the top in that profession then youve got managers who get 250k and partners who get around a million.

as for people who waste time at uni - there are plenty - just as there are plenty of school dropouts who dont go onto skilled jobs in IT, plumbing etc.. and instead work in call centers.

fact is that graduates earn more on average than non graduates

Point is though that even with degrees, probably the majority of people these days arent going to be in the 6-figure salary bracket, and some of them might have been better off plastering.

There is another arguement in all of this about enjoying your job and all the rest of it I suppose, but money does make the world go around.

Quote from: Dave

Quote from: Eggtasticoat the extreme end of the scale there are a top few plumbers who can earn 90k - i.e. what an average accountant can get fairly easily after a few years but if you compare with the top in that profession then youve got managers who get 250k and partners who get around a million.

I think that depends where in the country you are.

You wont get them wages around here for an accountant, but a Plumber would earn more than an accountant.

Only a select few would actually get those high paid jobs.
My mate is a qualified accountant & he cant get anywhere near the £90k you mention & he lives in London.

Most skilled labourers are self employed/contractors, where as most accountants are employed by big firms.

yes Im not disputing the fact that some skilled laborers earn more than some professionals - there is bound to be a good deal of overlap - the point Im making is that overall the average pay is much higher for professionals.

Location probably does have a part to play & no doubt some regional solicitors/accountants who dont run their own business probably do earn less than the local self employed plumber.

i wouldnt drop any subjects from the current curriculum. i would advocate for keeping them because everybody has different subjects they enjoy, or are good at.

say someone is fantastic at art, but is sh*t at geography and physics, it caters for different types of people.


also a large amount of schooling also contains what makes us a culture, either out on the field in the middle of january playing rugby or complaining about the school dinners.

Quote from: Daveyes Im not disputing the fact that some skilled laborers earn more than some professionals - there is bound to be a good deal of overlap - the point Im making is that overall the average pay is much higher for professionals.

You really think? Vast amount of teachers & medical people are paid bucket loads.

A normal bricky working for a sub contracting firm would easily get £30k a year.

Quote from: EggtasticoYou really think? Vast amount of teachers & medical people are paid bucket loads.

A normal bricky working for a sub contracting firm would easily get £30k a year.

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=285

QuoteThe occupations with the highest earnings in 2006 were 'Health professionals, (median pay of full-time employees of £1,038 a week), followed by 'Corporate managers' (£688) and 'Science and technology professionals' (£662).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/6157219.stm

QuoteGPs who worked in dispensing practices, which have a pharmacy attached, earned an average of £128,000 after expenses - a rise of 31%.

Non-dispensing GPs earned an average of £102,000 after expenses - 30% more than in 2003-04.

Quote from: Dave

Quote from: EggtasticoYou really think? Vast amount of teachers & medical people are paid bucket loads.

A normal bricky working for a sub contracting firm would easily get £30k a year.

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=285

QuoteThe occupations with the highest earnings in 2006 were 'Health professionals, (median pay of full-time employees of £1,038 a week), followed by 'Corporate managers' (£688) and 'Science and technology professionals' (£662).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/6157219.stm

QuoteGPs who worked in dispensing practices, which have a pharmacy attached, earned an average of £128,000 after expenses - a rise of 31%.

Non-dispensing GPs earned an average of £102,000 after expenses - 30% more than in 2003-04.

and everyone who works in the Health Sector with degrees are GPs arent they?

nope but Im talking about professionals in general - you quoted a specific example in the form of builders Im merely pointing out that there are also, surprise surprise, plenty of specific examples amongst professionals that completely blow away and skilled labourers earnings. And yes it would also be very easy to point out that even someone doing night shifts at a 24 hour tescos probably earns more than a teacher or student nurse - but that isnt going to prove or disprove anything

All I am saying is that as a general rule of thumb professionals earn more on average than skilled workers - that is all Ive said all along - quoting a brick layers annual salary doesnt change that fact.

(btw.. the first link was for health professionals not just GPs)

what does this have to do with dropping subjects from the school curriculum?

hey it is SC  :mrgreen:

serious was arguing about the cost of plastering a room on the last page

anyway wasnt the original topic/article about the quality of education in the UK vs poland?