Hamilton could still be crowned Champion, some cheats finished in front of him

IF the FIA want to be the all might law an fair bosses of the sport they should take action if every little thing McLaren do needs investigating and punishment or it is double standards and will prove the point that McLaren have been picked on all season


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7055644.stm
http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=41157

For me the FIA have to punish the teams with their places, if you take every action they have took on McLaren this season and then if they ignore this it will indeed but just total proof that they have picked on McLaren and it has been the FIA and Ferrari who have spoilt their season

QuoteArticle 6.5.5 of the Formula 1 technical regulations states: "No fuel on board the car may be more than 10 degrees centigrade below ambient temperature."

FIA technical delegate Jo Bauer reported that the fuel samples from all four cars showed temperatures 12-14C lower than the ambient at the time.

Clear cut to me, if they are below they are below

should do the same to the team as they did to McClaren, Punish them of their constructors points & not the individual.

Quote from: Eggtasticoshould do the same to the team as they did to McClaren, Punish them of their constructors points & not the individual.

Different circumstances, the rules are clear on this
McLaren were found to have issues in regard to technical data but no proof (although max mozley has put his opinion out there but the offical stance is different  that the cars performance was as a result of the other teams data etc

In this the fuel temp can give the car speed advantage and the rules state you get disqualified if this is found. McLaren had the exact same thing happen to them last season or the season before and they were disqualified and they tried to appeal due to different ambient temperatures given out but lost the appeal.
McLaren will be rightly pissed off if the FIA ignore this and it will be a clear cut  vindictive attack on McLaren  this season be Ferrari and their big boys in the FIA and will be clear for all to see

If I was Lewis Hamilton Im fairly sure I wouldnt want to win the championship like that.

Quote from: BigSoyIf I was Lewis Hamilton Im fairly sure I wouldnt want to win the championship like that.

No, but it would answer why you could not catch up with those guys and you would expect and why there were surprisingly quick
And if there is no valid base to check the temps on as they say? Why are only these cars in question, all the others are fine enough so if these cars are enough to be noticed to be irregular the rules are quite clear besides as a season whole Hamilton would deserve it, Kimi deserves a championship but not really this one and he really has only got it on the back of McLaren being nailed for every small thing

Quote from: BigSoyIf I was Lewis Hamilton Im fairly sure I wouldnt want to win the championship like that.

totally agree with you, especially as hamilton threw his whole chance away at the 1st corner when he lost his head & then ended up shortly after off the track.

As Alonso has said, its Embarrasing - Kimi has been the best driver & hes proven it.

Quote from: Eggtastico

Quote from: BigSoyIf I was Lewis Hamilton Im fairly sure I wouldnt want to win the championship like that.

totally agree with you, especially as hamilton threw his whole chance away at the 1st corner when he lost his head & then ended up shortly after off the track.

As Alonso has said, its Embarrasing - Kimi has been the best driver & hes proven it.

Actually that was not what caused him to loose it, The two red cars did a very sneaky planned trick to hold him up and it caused alonso to have more speed out the turn and Hamilton lost his rag a bit but if he was where he was and how fast he was in the middle of the race he was for an easy 5th-4th and the championship
It was the mystery gearbox engine thing that appeared then went away that killed the race for him

Definitely one to take it on the chin, nail a few of the pit girls to commiserate and hopefully come back next season with a different driving partner who would actually work as a team to help Lewis blitz all comers for the championship.

Also I thought this was a quality quote from Hamilton:

Quote"Its been a crazy year and I honestly cant say Im really gutted. I finished second in the world championship. I beat my team-mate under extremely difficult circumstances. I beat the two-time world champion. That was the goal."
 Lewis Hamilton may not have won the F1 title - but at least he had the last laugh over Fernando Alonso.
 

QuoteProblems with his McLaren put Hamilton to the back of the field early on.

QuoteHamilton quickly set about regaining places, but ran into more problems on lap eight, when he slowed almost to a halt as his car slipped out of gear ...had lost more than 40 seconds....

^What difference did the fuel make here? 10degree drop= 1% more density if Google is right. K, you might save a nanosecond refueling but by the time that fuel reaches the combustion chamber that 3-4c is gone.  

QuoteNico Rosberg finished fourth in his Williams while the BMW duo of Robert Kubica and Nick Heidfeld were fifth and sixth.

So the Williams guy who finished behind Hamilton didnt have dodgy fuel, but the Williams guy who finished ahead of him did. Logical. The whole F1 thing is getting to be a farce. Im glad I stopped following it properly years ago. Lewis is a whiny little smug bitch anyway and I hope he goes back to cart racing or sommink.

its clear, if Lewis was cheating they would throw the book at him, also if he had the cold fuel, hed have finished first.

heres a quote.

"If you put chilled or cool fuel into a car you get between 5 and 10 horsepower increase"

Eddie Jordan

Quote from: sdp

QuoteProblems with his McLaren put Hamilton to the back of the field early on.

QuoteHamilton quickly set about regaining places, but ran into more problems on lap eight, when he slowed almost to a halt as his car slipped out of gear ...had lost more than 40 seconds....

^What difference did the fuel make here? 10degree drop= 1% more density if Google is right. K, you might save a nanosecond refueling but by the time that fuel reaches the combustion chamber that 3-4c is gone.  

QuoteNico Rosberg finished fourth in his Williams while the BMW duo of Robert Kubica and Nick Heidfeld were fifth and sixth.

So the Williams guy who finished behind Hamilton didnt have dodgy fuel, but the Williams guy who finished ahead of him did. Logical. The whole F1 thing is getting to be a farce. Im glad I stopped following it properly years ago. Lewis is a whiny little smug bitch anyway and I hope he goes back to cart racing or sommink.

Firstly fuel does make a difference hence the rule in the regulations which is very specific because this has been locked down and the punishment in black and white.

Your wrong in your thinking about two cars in the same team, it is a team but you basically have to sub teams in it. You have two teams of engineers and heads and then the management above and they run there own race, fuel and tactic plans for each driver normally.
Different fuel pumps as well and it is indeed possible to have different fuel mixes (in compliance with the regulations) and is not uncommon to have quite a few differences between team cars
The fact the other Williams and the performance matchings they just shown on sky actually makes the valid point the fuel could have been a factor for the speed and with the past actions taken on McLaren by the FIA in previous years in this regard and other teams as well as other data McLaren are sure they have a case. They did not appeal willy nilly like say ferrari so McLaren will probably feel they have a case

FFS this is pathetic.  What does kimi have to do?

Yes it would be double standards if it is proved to be foul play but in this case it is the constructor that should be punished not the driver.  It is no way for a title to be handed over.

I have no sympathy for Mclaren.  The fact of the matter is Lewis screwed up when the pressure was on.  He had a nervous start and tried to fight Alonso when he didnt need to.  He was on about it all week not feeling under any pressure.  Mclaren screwed up China when they only need a few points and took risks.

After the events of this year yes, I am slightly gratified that Alonso didnt get a third title.  But it would have been an achievement.

I am pleased that Raikkonen has got the Title. He has deserved it at least twice allready, to be stopped by a c**p mclaren car.  It seems that bug came back to haunt Hamilton this year with their bullet prrof car.  This year he has been with ferrari he has had to deal with 2 more mechanical failures than either alonso or Hamilton.  Not to mention his 6 wins to Alonsos & Hamiltons 4.  Dont bring up the more consistent driver argument.....

What Kimi has done is keep his mouth shut and just do the job on the track. Something Hamilton hasnt managed to do. There is no doubt he is a talented man and has a bright future. But he was gifted the best car this year and in the end inexperiance and pressure was allways going to have a say in this championship. But in the moments that it matter mosts, thats what makes the difference in a championship decider.

I got so tired of reading every week what Hamiltons mood was, or why they cant win a certain race and get their arses handed to them.

On a side note how did Hamilton beat Alonso.  They both are on 109 Points?

QuoteYes it would be double standards if it is proved to be foul play but in this case it is the constructor that should be punished not the driver.  It is no way for a title to be handed over.

Rules are very clear on this, the stewards could not decide and bottled on the decision but the rules are quite clear on if a decision can be made on ambient temperatures and McLaren have president becuase they have had it done too them at least twice and they had been disqualified from those races and other cases as well. You cant change the rules becuase it means a new champion would be crowned.

QuoteI have no sympathy for Mclaren.  The fact of the matter is Lewis screwed up when the pressure was on.  He had a nervous start and tried to fight Alonso when he didnt need to.  He was on about it all week not feeling under any pressure.  Mclaren screwed up China when they only need a few points and took risks.

This is untrue, nerves were there and he made and error but it was forced by very clever tactics from Ferrari but he would have won the championship no problem finishing around 4th if you hold the rest of the race up no problem if not 3rd. It was an engine glitch sending him down to 18th that was the killed and a team fault NOT hamiltons, same in China not his fault either, So this is an untrue statement about him

QuoteAfter the events of this year yes, I am slightly gratified that Alonso didnt get a third title.  But it would have been an achievement.

Of course but his attitude has been appalling

QuoteI am pleased that Raikkonen has got the Title. He has deserved it at least twice allready, to be stopped by a c**p mclaren car.  It seems that bug came back to haunt Hamilton this year with their bullet prrof car.  This year he has been with ferrari he has had to deal with 2 more mechanical failures than either alonso or Hamilton.  Not to mention his 6 wins to Alonsos & Hamiltons 4.  Dont bring up the more consistent driver argument.....

He has deserved it and let down by oh surprise his team (McLaren) and that is not on but he did not deserve it this season, Things off the track have given him the chance to win this year

QuoteWhat Kimi has done is keep his mouth shut and just do the job on the track. Something Hamilton hasnt managed to do. There is no doubt he is a talented man and has a bright future. But he was gifted the best car this year and in the end inexperiance and pressure was allways going to have a say in this championship. But in the moments that it matter mosts, thats what makes the difference in a championship decider.

He stayed out the way this is true but he would not have been in the position of the things of this year have went on

QuoteOn a side note how did Hamilton beat Alonso.  They both are on 109 Points?

It goes to wins and poles

Hamilton had a 16 point  lead over kimi with 4 race wins a piece lead in china and squandered it.  Thats an achievement of keeping the faith

How can you say he did not deserve it?  2 More race wins, when it mattered.  Not to mention 2 more mechanical failures/retirements.  There is absolutely no justifying why kimi did not deserve it.  Ill type that again.  6 wins.

QuoteThis is untrue, nerves were there and he made and error but it was forced by very clever tactics from Ferrari

I really dont know which race you were watching.  There is no shame in a rookie not knowing how to see out a championship.

Its typicall of the British to praise someone so much and put so much pressure on them when they are any good.  I can really see him being the next Jenson Button.  That was his chance.

Quote from: CypherI can really see him being the next Jenson Button.  That was his chance.

And I really thought you knew what you were on about until then...

There is a reason that this kid has been groomed since by McClaren since he was barely old to walk into a cockpit. He is special despite the ultimate table standings this year.