Author Topic: Upgrade Time!  (Read 13471 times)

  • Offline Kunal

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #45 on: November 20, 2007, 19:15:59 PM
Maybe its just me but I wouldnt hand over £1600 for a pre-built.

To reiterate just how high a sum that is for PCs these days you could put together a Dual Xeon 8 core system for that much.

£250 - Dual S771 Xeon motherboard from Tyan/Supermicro
£350 - 2 x 1.86GHz Quad Core Xeons
£200 - 4 x 1Gb DDR2-667 ECC DIMMs

Thats £800

Then spank the other £800 on graphics, sound, drives, case, psu...


I dont see the point in going for anything more than a Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600. At £160-170 its impossible to beat for the amount of performance youre getting, not to mention its very easy to overclock. I also dont see the point in not going for 4Gb of RAM and a 64bit OS. RAM is dirt cheap these days, you can pick up 4Gb of DDR2-800 for £75!

As youve got the money and you want drive speed Id definitely go for RAID-5 or RAID 1+0 using 500Gb drives. If you really want you can slap a Raptor on top as your boot drive but theyre not that quick these days compared to some of the larger drives. Dont skimp on the case and PSU, get something with a well thought out cooling system. As far as graphics go its your choice between the 8800GT and Radeon HD 3870 right now, I wouldnt bother looking at the GTSs/GTXs and Ultras. Unless youve got great onboard sound (i.e. it has Dolby Digital Live OR DTS Connect) go for one of the Auzentech cards theyre pretty much the best.

  • Offline Serious

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #46 on: November 20, 2007, 20:15:05 PM
 :stupid:

On the other hand you could just put a pair of dual cores in there and wait for the upgrade cost to drop. I dont know many games that would seriously benefit from four cores ATM. There also needs to be time adjusting programs to run on the multicore processors efficiently.

Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #47 on: November 20, 2007, 21:14:08 PM
You do realise that its just one socket inside there serious?  The Quad core is in 1 CPU.

Edit, Doh  Didnt see the tyan as an MP board.

  • Offline Eagle

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #48 on: November 20, 2007, 21:34:28 PM
Quote from: Kunal
Maybe its just me but I wouldnt hand over £1600 for a pre-built.

Im beginning to think the same.

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I dont see the point in going for anything more than a Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600. At £160-170 its impossible to beat for the amount of performance youre getting, not to mention its very easy to overclock.

Roger that.

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I also dont see the point in not going for 4Gb of RAM and a 64bit OS. RAM is dirt cheap these days, you can pick up 4Gb of DDR2-800 for £75!

Already decided to go for 64Bit OS.  Does WinXP64 only support AMD though?...

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As youve got the money and you want drive speed Id definitely go for RAID-5 or RAID 1+0 using 500Gb drives.

Hmm, I have little understanding of RAID.  My current drives are fast enough for me (for 2D) believe it or not (or at least I put up with it) so any standard improvement will be better.

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Dont skimp on the case and PSU, get something with a well thought out cooling system.

With you there.  Im very aware of the importance of good case design (been a Tekhead for years!  :D  ;) )

Quote
As far as graphics go its your choice between the 8800GT and Radeon HD 3870 right now, I wouldnt bother looking at the GTSs/GTXs and Ultras.

Got it. :)

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Unless youve got great onboard sound (i.e. it has Dolby Digital Live OR DTS Connect) go for one of the Auzentech cards theyre pretty much the best.

Sound quality isnt really that important to me - all I need it for is mp3ing as I work and if I can hear it, Im happy.  If I want hi-fi, Ill go and turn on my uber Technics rig. ;)  Points taken though. :)

Ill have three weeks spare in which to do a build come late December.  If I do go for a self-build, the trick will be to find a firm who offer either PayPal or a BNPL scheme... and somehow make a components list out of this thread! :D
 

Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #49 on: November 20, 2007, 21:40:44 PM
just chucked this together to give you something to work off.



the 512mb 8800gt is better and cheaper but they where out of stock.

  • Offline Kunal

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #50 on: November 20, 2007, 22:10:43 PM
Quote from: Eagle

Quote
As youve got the money and you want drive speed Id definitely go for RAID-5 or RAID 1+0 using 500Gb drives.

Hmm, I have little understanding of RAID.  My current drives are fast enough for me (for 2D) believe it or not (or at least I put up with it) so any standard improvement will be better.
 


While you will see some speed improvements using RAID-5 or 1+0 the main benefit is redundancy. Data is stored more than once, so if you do experience data loss or a drive going down you can fully recover.

This is not a alternative to a good backup plan, simply a compliment.

For RAID-5 you can use as little as 3 drives, so if you had 3x500Gb youll be able to use 1000Gb out of the 1500Gb the drives have.

Also consider drives with less platters. Using the example of 500Gb drives above, you can now get 2 platter 500Gb drives. This will give you an additional performance bump as the platters are denser, plus it will run quieter and cooler.

Samsungs new drives which are just hitting the market have platters with upto 334Gbs meaning they can offer a 3 platter 1Tb drive.

  • Offline Eagle

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #51 on: November 20, 2007, 23:42:21 PM
Thanks again. :)

Just talking to myself here for reference.  In view of advice, a slightly down-specd DELL system...

Dimension TM XPS 720

Intel® Core™ 2 Quad-Core Q6600 processor (2.40GHz, 1066MHz, 8MB cache)

Genuine Windows Vista® Home Premium - English (no XP64 option - best place to buy?)

No Monitor

4096MB 800MHz Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM [4x1024]

1TB Serial ATA RAID 0 Stripe (2x500GB 7200rpm drives with DataBurst™ cache)

16x DVD+/-RW & 16x DVD Drives

GRAPHICS CARD SINGLE 768MB nVidia® GeForce® 8800 GTX

Sound Blaster® X-Fi Xtreme Music PCI

Creative Inspire T7900 7.1 Speaker System

19-in-1 Media Card reader

No Modem

Base Warranty - 1 Year XPS Premium Hardware Support (incl. Gaming and On-Site Support)

£1,449.06

------

The thing that narks me about dell is they dont say what brand stuff is... and that makes me uneasy...  :?
 


  • Offline Cypher

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #52 on: November 20, 2007, 23:57:14 PM
They use all sorts through out the range, intel chipsets, nvidia and ati graphics, broadcom and intel NICs.  I think the memory is samsung.

They certainly dont but that unbranded generic memory that they used to do with all their systems, they have come a long way.

  • Offline Eagle

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #53 on: November 21, 2007, 00:18:45 AM
 
Im actually drawn to DELL because weve over 30 systems at work and theyre all absolutely rock-solid, no messin.

Anyways, further ramblings (tell me if Im getting warmer):

MESH Xtreme 8XGT

Intel® Core™ 2 Quad Q6600 Quad Core Processor(2.4GHz,8MB Cache,1066MHz)
Digital / Analogue TV Tuner PCI Card
Aluminium ATX Midi Tower + 550W PSU
SLI nForce 680i SLI(C55XE) - Intel Core 2 Duo/Quad-Core - ATX
4GB DDR2 667MHz Memory ( 4 x 1GB SS)
1TB (2x 500GB) Serial ATA Hard Drive with 16MB Buffer
LightScribe Super Format 18x Dual Layer DVD Writer +R/-R/RW/RAM (why would I want two?  Bizarre...)
512MB nVIDIA GeForce 8800GT
No monitor
Creative Labs Sound Blaster X-Fi Xtreme Gamer Sound Card (whatever)
Logitech S500 - 5.1 Speakers with Subwoofer
Multi-format Memory Card Reader
1 Year On Site* - UK Mainland Only

£1181.50

:)

  • Offline Serious

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #54 on: November 21, 2007, 00:37:55 AM
You would want two DVD writer drives so you can copy directly from one disk onto another without having to remove the first from the drive and replace it with the second.

Simple really. And looking better on price too.

  • Offline Eagle

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #55 on: November 21, 2007, 00:43:16 AM
Quote from: Serious
Simple really. And looking better on price too.
A lack of knowledge is a dangerous thing. ;)

  • Offline Eagle

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #56 on: November 21, 2007, 00:50:52 AM
 
Tbvfh, my itchy trigger fingers hovering over the wreck wallet button on the DELL XPS 720 rig...

Couple o points though:

4096MB 800MHz Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM [4x1024] Is 800Mhz wurf the extra expense?

1TB Serial ATA RAID 0 Stripe (2x500GB 7200rpm drives with DataBurst™ cache) Raid 0?... is this ok or is it easy to change (bearing in mind Ill be doing the XP64 thing)

SINGLE 768MB nVidia® GeForce® 8800 GTX No option for 512 or plain ol GT - still ok? No mention that mobo is dual GC ready...

Im assuming XP64 will be ok with this.  No details on mobo so unsure of upgradeability - do DELL screw you with this?

£1,449.06 - hmm... spensive but kinda trusted...

  • Offline Pete

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #57 on: November 21, 2007, 00:51:27 AM
Quote from: Eagle
 
Im actually drawn to DELL because weve over 30 systems at work and theyre all absolutely rock-solid, no messin.

Anyways, further ramblings (tell me if Im getting warmer):

MESH Xtreme 8XGT

Intel® Core™ 2 Quad Q6600 Quad Core Processor(2.4GHz,8MB Cache,1066MHz)
Digital / Analogue TV Tuner PCI Card
Aluminium ATX Midi Tower + 550W PSU
SLI nForce 680i SLI(C55XE) - Intel Core 2 Duo/Quad-Core - ATX
4GB DDR2 667MHz Memory ( 4 x 1GB SS)
1TB (2x 500GB) Serial ATA Hard Drive with 16MB Buffer
LightScribe Super Format 18x Dual Layer DVD Writer +R/-R/RW/RAM (why would I want two?  Bizarre...)
512MB nVIDIA GeForce 8800GT
No monitor
Creative Labs Sound Blaster X-Fi Xtreme Gamer Sound Card (whatever)
Logitech S500 - 5.1 Speakers with Subwoofer
Multi-format Memory Card Reader
1 Year On Site* - UK Mainland Only

£1181.50

:)


As far as I can tell this is the same spec but £80 cheaper;
 
Elite Q4 FX (includes upgrades - click to view)  
 
System Base Price: £ 594.89
Intel® Core™ 2 Quad Q6600 Quad Core Processor(2.4GHz,8MB Cache,1066MHz)
Genuine Windows Vista™ Home Premium Edition
Digital / Analogue TV Tuner PCI Card + Vista Remote [upg £ 14.54]
New MESH Midi-TowerATX Case + 550W PSU
PCI-Express Mainboard - SLI nForce 680i SLI(C55XE) - Intel Core 2 Duo/Quad-Core - ATX [upg £ 80.00]
4GB DDR2 667MHz Memory -( 4x 1GB )
1TB (2x 500GB) Serial ATA Hard Drive with 16MB Buffer [upg £ 75.00]
LightScribe Super Format 18x Dual Layer DVD Writer +R/-R/RW/RAM
512MB nVIDIA GeForce 8800GT - Dual DVI, HDTV, TV Out [upg £ 155.00]
Without 19" Widescreen TFT MESH Monitor [upg £ -75.00]
Creative Labs Sound Blaster X-Fi Xtreme Gamer Sound Card (oem) [upg £ 55.00]
Logitech S500 - 5.1 Speakers with Subwoofer [upg £ 25.00]
Logitech Cordless Keyboard & Cordless Optical Mouse
Free Microsoft® Works® 8.5 + 60 Days Microsoft Office Trial
Free Cyberlink Video Editing Suite - 7 titles (oem)
2x IEEE1394 Firewire (onboard)
1x Gigabit LAN (onboard)
Belkin Wireless G USB Network Adapter - External (F5D7050UK) [upg £ 17.02]
Multi-format Memory Card Reader (ATX)
Free Upgrade to 1 Year On Site* - UK Mainland Only (Repairline Ltd Warranty)
 
Subtotal: £941.45
vat: £164.75
Order Total: £1106.20

You could save another £80 by going for the cheaper motherboard (I dunno the diff) and save more by getting stuff like the soundcard & wifi seperately.
 
I know sh*ts bad right now with all that starving bullsh*t and the dust storms and we are running out of french fries and burrito coverings.

  • Offline Serious

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #58 on: November 21, 2007, 00:52:50 AM
Quote from: Eagle
Quote from: Serious
Simple really. And looking better on price too.
A lack of knowledge is a dangerous thing. ;)


Early today my main computer wouldnt work, no beeps or lights. Checked everything four times, nothing loose, all plugs in their sockets firmly. Then asked my brother to have a look. He plugged it in and the damn thing just started as if nothing had happened :evil:

 :rage:

Sometimes computers just hate you...

  • Offline Pete

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Re:Upgrade Time!
Reply #59 on: November 21, 2007, 00:58:51 AM
Quote from: Eagle
 
Im assuming XP64 will be ok with this.  No details on mobo so unsure of upgradeability - do DELL screw you with this?



Dunno about retail ones but on business pcs they do a bit - cheap, cheerful and not very upradeable/tweakable. Reliable though. Might be worth a Google to check the retail stuff.
I know sh*ts bad right now with all that starving bullsh*t and the dust storms and we are running out of french fries and burrito coverings.

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